Minnesota Classic Glastron Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: David CVX-16 on March 10, 2011, 11:12:06 PM
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Purchased this prop on e-Bay, making it the fourth one of this identical 21" pitch bronze Quicksilver I own. This one is next to new after 40 years with some minor scratches that can be removed, and appears to have factory cupping, which was an option back then. Came in original box. Will sharpen the blades, remove the rough edges, and polish. This one is number nine (not including the "trophy Prop") in the collection, with the possibility of adding one more.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/CuppedBronze21Prop009resize.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/CuppedBronze21Prop011resize.jpg)
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Guess I'm not the only one that keeps the box when I buy a prop. Nice find!
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Dave,
Is that one going into the loaner pool this spring?
Now that my engine is running correctly, i really need to start testing props.
Jim
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Ok...educate me....what does a 2-blade do/provide over a 3 or 4 blade propeller?
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Ok...educate me....what does a 2-blade do/provide over a 3 or 4 blade propeller?
Higher top end. But they're not much good for anything else. ie: Holeshot, midrange.
Hey David what are the chances of ya re-hubbin one of those for us OMC guys to try? Heh heh.
Y'know if you keep this type of behavior up we're gonna have to start callin you the "Prop Monger", 'stead of Prop Hunter ...
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/66585_DavePropHunter2.jpg)
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Good score Dave !
Now make her shine !
" Higher top end. "
Best for smaller/ligher boats looking for top speed.
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The advantage of two blades over three or four is that there are fewer blades cutting the water and creating resistance. The disadvantage is that they are slow out of the water and can not carry heavy loads because of the smaller blade area. They should also be balanced because there are only two blades. The bronze blades are thin and sharp.
In real words testing two years ago, this two blade bronze prop GPS's at 52.9 MPH versus 51 MPH with a Ballistic 21" three blade stainless steel and 49 MPH with a 20" Laser II stainless steel. Every boat and motor is different, and only by testing several can you find out the best.
This 21" Bronze prop was running 5,400 RPM at 52.9 MPH. The newer 115 HP Mercs have better porting and breathing and can turn higher RPMs and the 21" may still be the best prop for the 1988 115 HP Mercury, maybe 56 or 57 MPH at 5,800 to 6,000 RPM for a short distance, not sustained. If RPMs are too high, have a 23" pitch 2-blade bronze to try.
It will be interesting to try the props, even compare MPH between the four identical ones.
We'll have to have a prop testing day.
Doug, they could be refitted for the OMC motors. A prop shop was going to fit a OMC Raker to my Mercury.
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It will be interesting to see which prop will give you your best speed with the new Merc ...
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Nice score David,
It will be interesting to view the data once your testing begins. I'm especially interested to know how all of them work with your new powerhouse.
Melt snow melt!
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The unknown factor is the height of the motor. The bronze props need the lower motor height for bite, and the stainless steel need a higher motor setting because they are surface props.
Chris, maybe the answer is the manual 4 in 1 jackplate with 2" setback from Bob's Machine Shop where the height of the motor can be adjusted up and down.
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They ( Jackplates ) come up on CL once in a while or eBay should have it.
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Looks like I am going to have to repower with a 150 or I'll never catch up/keep up with you David. ;D
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Ross, the right prop will add alot of speed to what you are running now. The right prop is the same as more horsepower.
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Another prop to the collection, a Ballistic 22".
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/Ballistic22XL002resize.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/Ballistic22XL005resize.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/Ballistic22XL007resize.jpg)
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Your other Ballistic was a 21P ?
Your stocking up the arsenal ... LOL
We might be boating on lakes this spring, with all the flooding in the forcast !
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Gregg, yes the other Ballistic is a 21".
Get the home projects out of the way early to enjoy the shortened Minnesota boating season of 2011.
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Ross, the right prop will add alot of speed to what you are running now. The right prop is the same as more horsepower.
It will certainly help but I can not get the RPM's out of my 4 cylinder that you guys with the 6's can. 5K max recommended by the rebuilder and confirmed by Steve. Back to restraining myself. :(
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Ross, either the 21" 2-blade bronze or 21" Ballistic should run well at 5,000 RPM. I forgot if you have a tach or not. If not, you should get one installed or else use a hand held one just for testing.
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Another prop to the collection, this one a 23" pitch in case I ever need to go that high in pitch. This one purchased from Chris in Canada in great shape, just needed the blades sharpened, prop shop number removed, and polished.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/ChrissProp002.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/ChrissProp004.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/ChrissProp005.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/ChrissProp007.jpg)
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Looks great David... glad you will make use of it.
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Suweet David! Man that things gotta lotta rake. Yikes! No wonder they need to be submerged. I'd like to try one some day. Soon as I get a jack plate that is ... Nice find!
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Ross, either the 21" 2-blade bronze or 21" Ballistic should run well at 5,000 RPM. I forgot if you have a tach or not. If not, you should get one installed or else use a hand held one just for testing.
Yup, I have a tach.
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Finished the e-bay purchased 21" cupped 2-blade bronze with before and after pictures. Finished with props, now to sharpen (but not polish) lawn mower blades. Prop collection consists of 5 bronze, 3 stainless steel, and 2 aluminum (came with the 1988 115 HP Merc).
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/CuppedBronze21Prop009resize-1.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/CuppedBronze21Prop013resize.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/CuppedBronze21Prop014resize.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/CuppedBronze21Prop015resize.jpg)
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I'm picking up a 23p Raker tomorrow for cheap. I'm really anxious to try it on the 19...I think it'll be too much, but for $50...why not.
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Here we go again. Another prop to restore. Purchased from the original owner. Never reworked. Prop sat for 20 years collecting dust. It is a small eared chopper, 14 dimeter x 22" pitch, number 48-75770A-4 22. Will post pictures after cleanup is done. This is the 10th prop to the collection and the last. Joke to my understanding wife is that the prop collection is my retirement fund. Will be a prop to try if the motor is elevated on the transom 1-1/2 to 2"
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/MercChopper22001.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/MercChopper22003.jpg)
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A Raker for $50? :o That's a heck of a find since they run about $350 to $550 depending upon age and condition. I tried a 13 1/2 x 21 Raker on my 1977 115 Evinrude (CVX 16) and I dropped about 3 - 5 mph. I want to try the 19" next time. That is on hell of a smooth prop.
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a prop to try if the motor is elevated on the transom 1-1/2 to 2"
Yeah!! Now yer talkin' David! Heh heh
Looks kinda like an OMC SRX but what's up with the blades sticking in front of the hub. Maybe it's an optical illusion but just looks a lil weird from where I'm sitting?
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/nevrdull.jpg)
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Doug, those are weed cutters. Maybe they have a purpose, but I do not intend to travel through weeds. Could be that while racing weeds would otherwise wrap themselves around the prop were not for these sharp pieces of metal that cut them into small pieces.
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Aha! Now I understand. I avoid traveling through weeds too. Well, 'less it's really good weed ... Truth be known I'd like to hear more about this "racing weed"?!
Seriously I don't see how those cutters could do much if any weed choppin' on a small hub prop. I do see where they might could help if'n ya got tangled up in some monofiliment.
Interesting wheel Dave. I'm expecting once you work your magic on it it'll be bada$$.
Carry on!
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Finished the e-bay purchased 21" cupped 2-blade bronze with before and after pictures. Finished with props, now to sharpen (but not polish) lawn mower blades. Prop collection consists of 5 bronze, 3 stainless steel, and 2 aluminum (came with the 1988 115 HP Merc).
Beautiful work David! Too nice to submerge.
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After hours of working to remove scratches, here is what the prop looks like. It is meant to run with the motor off the transom. Prop is Mercury chopper 14" diameter x 22" pitch exhaust over the hub. Upon takeoff, the prop will rev up and then bite and fly at a certain point in time per the former owner. Stainless is harder than bronze to work on. Used combination of discs and sheets of sandpaper from 240, 320, 400, 600, 800, to 1500 and then to Mothers Alum and Alloy and Flitz. Top picture is the before and next three are the after.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/MercChopper22001-1.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/MercChopper22005.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/MercChopper22002.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/MercChopper22002-1.jpg)
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What do you use for sanding? Do it all by hand?
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Ya it takes a little finesse to run one of those choppers. But once you figure it out the mid-range acceleration is breathtaking. Oughta pick up some top end too.
Now all's ya need's a jack plate David so you can take full advantage of all them props? Heh heh
Nice job on the clean up btw. Looks real purty.
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Jason, to start, I use a 120 grit sanding disc on a 4 1/2" rubber pad attached to a power drill to get off the deep scratchs and nicks on the blades. May even use a file. After that, it is 240 grit wet or dry sheet 11" x 8" sandpaper torn into quarters and then folded to be used by hand, and then up the scale, all by hand, to 320, 400, 600, 800, and 1500 grit. At that point, the surface is smooth enough for the buffing compounds on a 3" cloth buffing wheel on a power drill can take over - buffing rouge, Mothers Mag and Aluminum Polish, and Flitz. After the buffing, then back to the areas that need more sanding and buffing.
This prop had scratches all over the blades, as you can see from the before pictures. Have about 5 to 6 hours of labor in it so far. Really a labor of love. I only do it about an hour or two per night.
With stainless, you have to hand sand to about 1500 grit before the machine buffing, whereas the bronze props only have to go to about 400 or 600 grit before the machine buffing polishes and erases the little scratchs from the sandpaper.
Doug, thought about a jackplate, but the ride glide steering cable comes out of a hole on the drivers side of the boat and I do not know if it could make the bend with the motor set back any further.
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5-6 hours! My hands cramp up just thinking about it!
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Polishing propellers is my outpatient occupational therapy.
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This bronze Mercury Quicksilver 19" pitch prop purchased on e-bay under false statements as to condition but seller refunded money 100% and said I could keep the prop. It needs a new rubber hub, $60 (old hub dry and cracked) and one blade missing some material. Will post pictures of the polishing process - my outpatient occupational therapy. Might become part of the Hard Luck Trophy.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/BronzeProp004.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/BronzeProp005.jpg)
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WELL !
The price was right !
Work your magic Dave ...
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Picture of the six bronze props - four 21" pitch, one 19" pitch, and one 23" pitch. The 19" (farthest away) is in the process of being buffed out. Note the difference in hub positions in the middle picture. The rubber hubs needs to be moved/pressed so that the washers on both ends of the hub fit into and match the hub recession. Craig at work will use a hydraulic press and cutting machine tool to fit the components.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/SixBronzeProps002.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/SixBronzeProps003.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/SixBronzeProps.jpg)
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Thats a cool picture (props) Dave ...
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Brought three bronze props to Bruce, retired prop shop man in Zimmerman, MN. He repositioned the rubber hubs on two of the props, and stated that the newest acquisition, an e-bay bronze prop, did not need a new hub. He could sense that as he moved the hub around on his press. Also Bruce sold me a different type of thrust washer needed for two of the props. Total cost for labor and parts was $25 plus the 90 mile trip to Zimmerman and back. He is an excellent source for prop repair and welding.
Craigslist ad: Prop and skeg repair, 30 years exp, new and used props for sale,.hub replacement any kind of welding,some motor and lower unit repair,most turn around is a couple of days, work out of my home. Hours are 9 to 5. 763-856-2435, Bruce
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Craigslist ad: Prop and skeg repair, 30 years exp, new and used props for sale,.hub replacement any kind of welding,some motor and lower unit repair,most turn around is a couple of days, work out of my home. Hours are 9 to 5. 763-856-2435, Bruce
David,
You should post this info in Vender section
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Thanks for the advice Jim, will do.
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Progress on the e-bay bronze prop. I did not think this one could be restored as it undoubtedly was outside for years. Sanded entire prop to remove stratches and tarnish. Slight imperfection on one of the blades tips. Almost done. Prop may be used by Glastron member who is restoring an old Glastron and Mercury motor.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/e-bay19bronzeprop006.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/e-bay19bronzeprop007.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/e-bay19bronzeprop008.jpg)
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Finished. Before and after photos. This bronze prop from the 1970's will decorate a Glastron and Mercury from the same era.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/BronzeProp001.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/BronzeProp005-1.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/e-bay19bronzeprop001.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/e-bay19bronzeprop013.jpg)
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Another awesome job David! You are truly the Propmaster! ;D
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You are the 'PROPMASTER' David
I hope you will let me try a couple of those out on my SSV sometime soon!
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Just one more prop to the collection, a Mercury Laser II 22 inch pitch bought on e-bay as used, but shows no signs of wear. Tryed this prop three years ago recording speed of 50 MPH at about 5,000 RPM (vs. 53.5 MPH with 2-blade 21" bronze). But hope that with the replacement 115 HP 1988 Merc at elevated height and with more horesepower, it may work.
Prop collection stands at 10, five stainless steel, four bronze, and one aluminum.
The prop came today by UPS, and tonight Joy and I went to Maplewood Mall to purchase her hair dryer and a pair of boots. She is really happy about the whole day.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/LaserII22pitch020resize.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/LaserII22pitch021resize.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/LaserII22pitch028resize.jpg)
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Looks to be in very nice shape Dave ...
Mind if I ask ... How much was it ?
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/66585_DavePropHunter2.jpg)
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Gregg, it was $150.00 plus freight of $15.
The prop was missing one of the vent plugs. Bought one today at Nelson's Marine for $1.50. The plugs come in four sizes, closed hole, and small, medium, and large holes. Mine came with the large holes, about 1/2" in diameter.
If any of my props do not work, Glastron members have first dibs at reduced prices before they go on the market.
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Ya take trade in's Dave ?
Just kiddin' .... LOL
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Nice find David. I still think y'oughta get a SRX & rehub it. But that's it. 11 props is the limit!
One more'n I'm recommending 'Prop-Anon' ...?
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If any of my props do not work, Glastron members have first dibs at reduced prices
That's mighty white of you Dave but why would anybody wanna buy a prop that didn't work. Even at a reduced price? Heh heh heh ... JK!
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I collect props for a purpose, to test them and if they do not work, they are sold. The prop collection will be down in numbers considerably by next fall.
Pictures of people who are serious prop collectors:
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/misc_props_019.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/BoatJunkYard10_27_07021.jpg)
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I have been looking for one. What size shaft and how many splines, what diameter should I be looking for?
I think I may have to get one re-hubed to get what I want.
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Jerry, are you looking for a prop for the 150 HP Merc Glastron GT160 boat? If so, it should have 15 splines, 13" to 13 3/4" diameter, 20" to 22" pitch, made for a Mercury outboard. Some of my props might work for you, and you are welcome to test them next year.
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Is it a 1" shaft?
I want 23-24 pitch
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Jerry, I just measured the prop shaft on one of my props, and it appears to be 1" in diameter. Your lower unit gear ratio is 1.7 to 1, and in my opinion, you should be looking for prop pitches in the 21" to 22" range.
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You may be right. Old habits are hard to break.
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Purchased another prop today. This will be my last one. My wife was not too happy. Will post pictures after I get it and get it polished. Used, but in perfect condtion. May work or may not work, only testing will tell.
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What brand ?
21 or 22 pitch ...
23P ?
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Gregg, I'll wait until it is finished to post the pictures and the stats. Pitch is 22". The prop is a long shot and if it does not work, maybe some else in our group may be able to use it. Bought it cheap.
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4 blade?
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No, not four blades. The more blades on a prop, the slower it is. I'm after top speed.
GPS speedometer reading not mine. LOL. Is that of an Allison boat with 280 HP racing Merc for sale for $32,000.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/boat3.jpg)
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My latest prop is a Mercury Quicksilver 2-blade bronze last made in the early 1970's. Called the Hi-Performance series to run on light boats with the motor raised. Came in even pitchs from 20" to about 30" in either a 13 or 14 inch diameter blade. Mine is a 22" pitch 13 inch diameter. Even with the prop in like new condition, took about four hours to get sand off the layer of grime and factory scratchs, blend the blade leading edges better near the hub area, and polish.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/22MercHiPerf002.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/22MercHiPerf004.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/22MercHiPerf006.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/22MercHiPerf009.jpg)
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Dave
Were your other bronze props 21 P ?
Looks like ya worked your magic on it !
SHINE ! SHINE !
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Gregg, yes the other bronze props were 21" pitch and a different shape to the blades. This is a special purpose prop which may or may not work.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/21bronzeProp007.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/22MercHiPerf002-1.jpg)
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sure looks mean!
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Here's a couple props from the the early 70's.....the stainless is from Mercury, a solid hub 28 pitch. I think it evolved into the choppers? Can anyone confirm that? The bronze is a Michican Wheel 27 pitch that is also a solid hub. I dug these out to run on a new 150 XS project I will be running this spring. Anyone have any info/experience with these?
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/donsprops.jpg)
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I tried a 2-blade Quicksilver stainless steel prop from Mark's prop shop many years ago on the Glastron V-153. I do not remember the pitch of the prop or if I had the 80 or 115 HP Merc at the time. But I do remember it not working or hooking up and the high RPM's for the low MPH traveling.
My closest props are the Mercury stainless steel 22" Chopper over the hub exhaust and the Mercury Hi-Performance 22" pitch 2-blade bronze, neither of which has been tested yet.
There was an article of the evolution of propellers over the years in Bass and Walleye Boats magazine years ago with the significant props along the way, the OMC Raker and the Quicksilver Chopper being two of them. The article also discussed the increase in technology in propeller design over the years so that the over the hub exhaust props may now only be 1 MPH faster or less than the through hub exhaust.
In the old days, one prop was designed for all types of boats. Now props are designed for a specific type of boat - low, medium, high performance and with difference characteristics - low torque, low, middle, high range acceleration, bow lifting, grip around corners, to the point where Bass and Walleye Boats in their testing of nine different props on the same boat and motor would give, in addition to the MPH attained, and the weak and strong characterists of each and then pick the best all around prop, and then not always the fastest.
They would also test the straight factory prop against the same worked over prop by DAH, or some other expert well known prop shop.
At both the Allison and the Scream and Fly Websites, they have sections devoted to prop discussions. I have never studied them in detail, but for high perforance boats, the best prop is invaluable, and the owners will go to all lengths to get the best. Another guide to selecting props is to read what props the Allison owners are using in both the Allison Owners site and the Bass Boat Central where owners tell the model of Allison, make and horsepower of the engine, height of propshaft to bottom of boat, prop make, whether modifed, and the MPH and RPM's.
http://forum.allisonowners.com/forumdisplay.php?f=11
http://allisonowners.com/xs2003.html
http://www.bassboatcentral.com/allison.htm
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OK first, Retro, who are you, and where are you????
I will be running basically the same motor 1500 shorty on a GT160. I want to try a Pro ET 23p. I think yours have too much pitch unless you plan on 90MPH.
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Jerry, his name is Don, owner of Retroperformance, member of TCPBA, and lives in Roseville. Don had a booth at last year's boat show.
http://www.retroperformancemarine.net/
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/BoatShow2011016resize.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/BoatShow2011018resize.jpg)
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Jerry, I believe the Mercury Pro ET is for the bigger Mercurys, having a diameter of 14 -1/2" with pitches from 26 to 32.
http://www.mercuryracing.com/propellers/proet.php
My guess is that you need a Chopper 22", Trophy 22", or a Laser II 22", all made for your small hub 150 HP Mercury.
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Jerry, I live in Roseville MN. I have worked in the twin cities boat industry for the past 35 years. I am expecting the XS to turn these pitches based on results of a 150XS on a CheckmateMX15 (480 pound hull) That my brother ran in the late 70"S. Why would you put a 15 inch mid on a GT160? What is the weight of your GT160. The attached photo is the hull the XS will run on.....it is about 100 pounds lighter than the MX. Who and where are you? By the way I do have an MX15 now with a 2.0 liter Mercury on it as well. If I can't spin those pitches I will go to smaller.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/checkmate75stinger.jpg)
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Hi Don. Welcome to the group. I'm in Bloomington. I'm an old drag racer that got sucked into boats about 10 years ago with a Glasspar Seafair Sunliner with a buick V6 It's still in the garage with a 3.8 stringer mount to go in. I picked up a '58 Glastron FireFlite and turned it into a 50's style hot-rod.
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh181/50sflash/0705_025.jpg)
Then a '57 Larson All American I found in the junk yard.
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh181/50sflash/DSC02926.jpg)
Then went to California and got a '59 Classic Barracuda that I'm putting twin '68 Johnson 35s on
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh181/50sflash/DSC00217.jpg)
This group runs fast. The FireFlite won't keep up, so when Ole Red had this GT160 with the dash moved back 18" we went down to Oklahoma City last Memorial weekend and picked it up.
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh181/50sflash/GT16035.jpg)
Why the short mid? Cool factor and I think it will work better than a bunch of jack plate. I have a lot of time and money into it, so I hope it works.
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh181/50sflash/DSC00988Medium.jpg)
As an old hot-rodder I try to do what nobody else has done. Any fool can buy a fast boat and big motor, it takes something special to take a slow boat and make it fast.
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Thanks for the welcome.....nice collection, I really like the GT 160 with the cockpit moved back.....If I can be of help with set up let me know, As for any fool can buy a fast boat and a big motor...........I did this this winter as well, and more than a couple people have called me a fool. LOL
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That's gonna sink!!
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I hope not, I think the angle of the picture makes it look funny....here it looks better. Power to weight ratio......here the weight of the power is the same as the weight of the boat. Can you have too much power?
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David.....I was doing some house cleaning at the shop today and I found this.....a stack of vintage 2 blade Mercury I6 props. The top one is bronze and the rest are aluminum. Maybe we can hit Owasso or Johanna this spring for some testing....
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Don, what is the part number on the 2-blade bronze prop? Mercury made several 2-blade bronze props throughout the years, their best 21" pitch prop, in my opinion, is 48-49630. I plan on testing 8 different props one after another this spring once the '88 115 Merc is on the V-153. Should be interesting. You are certainly welcome to test any of these props on your setup or if you have anything in the 21" to 22" pitch range, that would be great. Last year, Ross and Jason came along to White Bear Lake for testing in the spring. Maybe we can set up a prop testing day for all those interested.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAmn/PropCollection005.jpg)
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Hard to read....looks like maybe 48-20392, it is a 15 inch pitch. Anybody need something like that? The aluminums are all 21 pitch. Most of my stainless is 23 pitch and up. I did repower the Challenger with a 135 Johnson with a cle low pick up gearcase this winter and will need to dial that in this spring. I likly have a 22" Laser (and I have the vent plugs for them as well).
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Don -
I have a feeling I'll be needing a 15 pitch. 17 at most.
1976 Mercury 1150 on a GT 150. At some point it was paired with a lower unit with a different gear ratio. WOT gets me up to about 4900 RPM. I'm guessing a 15 would get me into the 5400 - 5600 range.
What is the diameter on your 15? What do you think you'd sell it for? And finally - will that prop work with my motor? - I haven't read the whole thread, started at the end reading forward ...
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I'll be in the market for a 22p Laser myself, or other brand of that pitch.
Will be at the prop testing day with a 20P Laser that will be for sale.
Over rev's my Merc by about 400 rpm's.
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The 15 pitch will fit a 1975 115....David may know the diameter________(David please fill in the blank) otherwise I can check the part number with Mercury at work Monday. I think I would sell it for a 12 pack (Michalob Lager) What is the top speed of a GT150 running a 17 at 4900? Remember there are different prop hardware configurations for different wheels, not a problem but just need to be sure the right stuff goes together.
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Don -
The GT150 came with the Merc on it, and a 19 inch stainless prop - that prop had a spun hub, but the very nice marine dealer servicing the boat convinced me a new lower unit was necessary. Replaced the lower unit and kept the same prop & the same problems. Discovered the worn splines & replaced with a 19 inch aluminum ... I believe 13-3/4" diameter.
The boat tops out around 41 mph (41.4 on gps). Smoother water, half fuel, I might get a tiny notch better.
I've been ok with the acceleration & the plane time ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENaLqJSTVcw
I would like a little better top end ... high 40's would be nice. More than that, though, I'd love to have enough bite to corner hard.
Is the prop a fixed hub? My stainless was, the aluminum on there now isn't. For a 12 pack, you're on - as long as I can make use of it. Even if I don't keep it on, it's worth the 12 pack to try it out.
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Don, your 2-blade bronze prop is part number 48-30392A1 13-1/2" diameter, 15" pitch from the Mercury prop chart below:
http://www.maxrules.com/oldmercs/Propellers/Props/11.pdf
WetRaider, your prop man probably installed a lower unit from a 80 HP or 150 HP Mercury that changed your lower unit ratio and the pitch your motor requires. Your RPM should be around 5,300 WOT. A cupped prop will grip in turns much better than one that is not cupped.
Gregg, we will try a few props on your CV 16 to get the best performance. You should be in the low fifty's MPH at 5,250 to 5,300 RPM. I have a 22" Laser II, older model Mercury stainless steel 21", Ballistic 21" and 22" stainless steel, PowerTech 21" stainless steel, and the Mercury 2-blade bronze 21" to try.
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I CHECKED STOCK.....I HAVE LASERS IN 22...24...26 WETRAIDER ARE YOU IN THE TWIN CITIES?
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If this mild winter keeps up we might have a early spring ...
Still seems like a long time till spring.
We might need a prop testing week ... LOL
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The prop testing can be spread out over the summer, accomodating different peoples schedules. With the different year of 115 HP Mercury on the Glastron, I will need some "seat time" getting used to the new charactistics of the motor, higher MPH, weight balance considerations, higher height of motor, etc. before serious prop testing. I have the advantage of two week days off per week and White Bear Lake down the road eight miles away.
The prop collection needs to be thinned down. After assigning an optimistic price to each of the 12 props, I came up with a total amount over $2,200. Estimate the number to keep will be about six to seven, the rest being sold to Glastron members first and then listed on various sites to be sold.
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With the lack of snow will White Bear be deep enough to launch/run? I heard it was low last year?
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Anybody have any large hub props that us inboard guys can play with?
We want to play too.
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Launching was no problem last year on White Bear Lake as they dug a channel for boats marked on each side. But the Lake is down in general and one should be aware of the shallow areas.
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David, I dug this one out today to try on the new 150xs project as well. It was built for a mod vp boat.....13.5 X 27....the smallish diameter won't carry a lot of weight but if it is light and has natural bow lift it runs out well. I have run it on 2.0 v6 and inline 6....If Jerrys GT 160 is light with the weight moved 18 inches back he might benifit from the transom lift.....I think it works better on in lines for recreational use.
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Yes, with Jerry's motor raised so high and with the weight moved back, he may need a prop like this. 27" pitch may be too high though.
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Jeff the Mercury inline boys need a pit crew, someone to turn the wrenches taking off the props and putting them back on, someone to record the stats, someone to take pictures in general and of the GPS MPH, someone to keep track of the water patrol, and someone to hand the drivers some cold refreshments as they rest between prop runs. We need alot of help.
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" Jeff the Mercury inline boys need a pit crew, someone to turn the wrenches taking off the props and putting them back on, someone to record the stats, someone to take pictures in general and of the GPS MPH, someone to keep track of the water patrol, and someone to hand the drivers some cold refreshments as they rest between prop runs. We need alot of help. "
We'll try ya for a weekend and if ya work out Jeff ... We'll let ya do it full time ....
Please bring your prop wrench and spare lock washers and nuts.
Your CVX will come in handy, if we need to make it out to a boat in trouble.
I've worked with ya before Jeff ... I'll put in a good word for ya with Dave !
... LOL
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That might be just what I'm looking for. Can a prop shop tweek it to 25"?
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could be modified but if nothing else it could be used for informational purposes.....run it and then try another based on results..............CVX, want to try a high five? we might have to file the edges a little but.......for real what are most guys running, thru hub cleavers, mirage, aftermarket or ? I may have something. Do you also run GT 150 with a 110? You could always bring that to outboard prop test day. What do you use on that one?
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I've been told the High-5's are great for our I/O's. I mostly kneeboard & boat with ours, although the kids are now into water skiing.
My CVZ was a dog pulling an adult up on a single ski...the bow wouldn't come down to get over the wake. Mostly a function of that MC-1 drive I suspect.
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I have had good sucess with the High Fives......also lots of luck with the Alpha 4 Aluminum, seem to run nice and retail is about 211.00
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The title should now be "Another Prop Sold from the Collection." Now down from 14 props to 7 props with one still for sale. With the addition of the 115 HP Johnson on the CVX-16, have concentrated on OMC props. Still saving the bronze ones for the 1988 Merc 115 backup. Here are the seven (2 bronze, 1 pictured):
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Actually, I'm trying to modify a Mercury Quicksilver 21" pitch 2-blade bronze prop to fit the 115 HP (new HP rating method) Johnson. The bronze prop ran 53.5 MPH at around 5,500 RPM on the old Glastron V-153 with a 115 HP (old HP rating method) Mercury and was my fastest prop by far. Hope to beat the 55.0 MPH of the 22" OMC Raker on the Glastron CVX-16. Took the prop over to Formula Prop and Marine in Dayton, MN today. The prop can be rehubbed without a problem to fit the Johnson spline. The critical issue is to machine the prop's bronze cylinder wall down to fit inside the Johnson housing without the bronze wall becoming too thin. A machinist will determine the possibility soon. Prop shop said "You are not in a hurry are you?" I said, "Get it done by May of 2013."
If the prop can be modified, it will be a long winter of waiting to find out.
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David, "don't do it", That prop is too perfect as is, sell this one to me for my Merc 115 and we'll find a good prop to cut down/modify for the OMC project ;D
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Mark, you may have to resort to switching the 2-blade bronze 21" pitch prop from the GT-150 to the V-166. You can only use one boat at a time. Switching takes about 5 minutes. I do not bend the tabs over.
Thought about getting an OMC 21" pitch two blade bronze prop, but from talking to a few people, that design is not fast.
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Mark, you may have to resort to switching the 2-blade bronze 21" pitch prop from the GT-150 to the V-166. You can only use one boat at a time. Switching takes about 5 minutes. I do not bend the tabs over.
Thought about getting an OMC 21" pitch two blade bronze prop, but from talking to a few people, that design is not fast.
Yes David, I know what you mean... that's what I'll do in the mean time, but definitely want to find another so I don't have to switch and have a back up. I had to say something to you since that prop is so perfect the way it is. ;D You don't bend the tabs over?... that would make the swap easier for certain. No worry about loosing one?
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Have not lost a prop yet by not bending the tabs over. Just be sure the nut is tightened firmly, do not go in reverse for any length of time, and check the tightness of the nut periodically.
I have a backup 21" 2-blade bronze prop that is reserved for the 1988 Merc 115 HP if I ever switch over from the Johnson.
I am still looking for this prop for you Mark.
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Mark ...
We may get into a bidding war over that prop ....
LOL
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yea, Haha... it's a fast one Gregg.
Thanks David.
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FAST & smooth ...
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Anybody have any large hub props that us inboard guys can play with?
We want to play too.
I've got a handful of props from 17-21 pitch sitting at home for the Mercruisers. Sold the 23 pitch i had. None are for sale at this point, but I'll let them be tested.
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My 13 ¾ x 23 has a Johnson hub installed. It has bigger blades than your 13 x 21. They barely clear the skeg. I use a 1/8†washer to set back. Thinned blades to .200â€. I manually ground down the recess flange to appx 3.850â€. Cupped heavy. David you need to convert your 2 blade 22†High Per bronze if you still have it. Do you have rpm/speed from your Merc for this prop? Mine’s on a n 80 CVX with a 140 Looper. Will send performance specs when I get back on the lake next year.
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Welcome to CGOAMN Carlover !
Dave will be happy to hear the 2 blade bronze can be converted to J/E hub ...
I think you and Dave will have a lot in common !
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/DavePropHunter2.jpg)
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I just discovered my twin. We talk the same language. Your information suggests that the wall of the Mercury prop can be thinned to fit inside a Johnson gear housing. Good to know. Formula Prop has yet to get back to me regarding the possibility of the conversion.
You are probably using prop C48-31450A3 13 3/4" x 23". My A48-49630 is 13 3/4 x 21" pitch. Your 23" pitch may actually be less than that, as the older Mercury props overstated their pitch.
The stats on the 13 3/4" x 21" pitch on a V-153 Glastron with a 1974 115 HP rated at the powerhead Merc are 53.5 MPH at about 5,500 RPM.
I calculate that my 21" pitch 2-blade bronze will be within an acceptable RPM range of the 115 Johnson. I hope for 56-57 MPH at 5,700 to 5,800 RPM. This summer turned 55.0 MPH at about 5,450 RPM using a 22" OMC Raker.
The remaining question is whether or not the 2-blade bronze can top the Raker prop. The Raker has bow lift that the 2-blade bronze does not.
The 22" Hi-Performace 2-blade bronze is sold and never was tested for its potential.
The blades of the 2-blade bronze props are very sharp as I occasionally cut myself.
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Hi David Lots of questiions. Shouldn't you be scooping snow right now? I spent all P.M. yesterday trying to find your Q about the Merc 2 blade. Just found it on CGOA and was going to paste in my answer from here. I also have a 22" raker and 21" Michigan same as Belwood laker had and sold on this site. I'm trying to find all of his posts because I think he is my twin. The last I remember I was running 56-5800 No gps but I remember these props on my 115 Merc at about 14-16% slip. With it trimmed up it shoots a rooster tail like a jet boat. I always wanted a QS hi-Performance when I had a 1970 135 on a V-163. I also had a 21 2 blade then(With my 1970 Merc 115 on my CVX in 1980) Bought a 1985 120 Johnson;trouble with the idle; traded it for a 87 140 with the small LU (110cu, they went to 120cu in 88). The 120 had a 2.15 ratio; Borrowed a 21 SST Got good acceleration; don't remember top end. I left a cvx with a 135 merc on it in my spray a few yrs ago with the bronze 23 with the 140. His was chine walking pretty bad. I had the raker doing it last time I used it. How is your compression? I'm running about 125-130 on the 87 Looper. Are you close to sea level in MN. That could make a diff but does your 85 have thick head gaskets; don't remember if they were detuned in 85? I noticed you use premimum. Where is your speedo pickup? When mine was by the lifting strake it would run about 3 mph+. I moved a new one down. Pretty accurate now. Also have level trim tabs which may be acting as brakes when I trim up. The Raker chine walks at 53. I'll try the 21 next ; less diameter (13"). I see you are close to the lakes but I know of a blue cvx that used a strap and it wore through the gelcoat.
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My outboard motor is a 1985 Johnson 115 HP rated at the propshaft. The compression is around 110 to 112, but the head gaskets were changed to thicker ones because of the problems with the quality of gas in the 1980's. I disconnected the VRO and plan to run the fuel from gas tanks in the back (on the floor or back seat). The speedometer hookup is from the outboard motor and is about 4 MPH faster than actual. I have the trim tab all the way to the left as viewed from the back of the boat.
I tested a new SST II 13 7/8" x 21" and a new SST II 12 3/4" x 21 " against a Raker 22" on the same day, and the Raker was 1 1/2 MPH faster than either of them.
I may or may not raise the motor one hole next spring. The Rakers would not break loose, but the 2-blade bronze probably would. Might also borrow a OMC SRX 23" to try.
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Raise the motor at least a hole. Add a Bob's Machine Shop 'true tracker. And buy your own SRX. Cuz if'n ya borrow one from somebody you might like it so much ya won't wanna give it back ...
I'd wager my vast family fortune ya won't find a faster 'stock' prop.
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Doug, I have asked someone if I can buy their SRX 23" prop. The SRX 23 may have the best top speed, but the Raker is a better all around prop - good at all speeds.
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Last week I found someone that tested a 23" srx. I can't find it now. He didn't like the way it revved with little acceleration out of the hole. But once it took hold it was ok. I wanted to try a new one long ago on my 140 but had to buy it. You probably know it cavitates like a vented prop. Some used to buy an exhaust can from Land & Sea. They are out of business now. I'm glad your bronze is 13 3/4. Slip it on your 88 Merc to see how it clears the bottom skeg; or pattern your Johnson to the Merc to compare. It should clear better than mine. Don't cut the flange off or it will blow out. I'd get it cupped right away. My metal lathe is 12" as most are, but you could mount it and cut the groove manually, rotate it and do the other half. And grind off the difference. Just a thought. If you re-weld a flange it would be hard to balance. Just found an interesting Tom Brown site:
http://www.100megsfree3.com/tombrown/boating/Performance/PerformanceTable.html (http://www.100megsfree3.com/tombrown/boating/Performance/PerformanceTable.html)
Someone just got a Carlson project boat in TN with a 79 Evinrude 140, compression checked about 135-140. My friend had a 78 115 that ran better than his 91 115 (De-tuned 140) Johnson on the same boat as mine. I'm about 1" up with a 1"+ setback spacer which brings the mount lower by about a 1/2". It used to porpoise before that.
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Alot of useful information. Believe FuzzButt with a CVX-16 with a 100 HP Johnson and jackplate from the national Glastron site runs a SRX 23" and he just bought a 22" Raker that he likes, but has not tested it fully.
The 13 3/4" clears the Mercury and the Johnson anticavitaion plate. I ran a OMC 13 7/8" diameter on the 115 HP Johnson and it clears.
The 2-blade Quicksilver bronze 21" pitch has been cupped and ventilation holes drilled it. Without cupping, the boat blows out and can not get on plane. Also in sharp turns the cupping prevents extreme slippage, keeps it to slight slipping which can be brought back by either trimming the motor in or backing off on the throttle.
We have a machinist at work, and he may be able to turn down the wall of the prop to fit inside the Johnson housing.
My Johnson is at 3/4" off the transom, and I get no porposing.
The Tom Brown chart is interesting. Wish the chart included some other good props, such as the Raker, Laser II, Ballistic, SRX, more 2-blade bronzes, and SST II. The ones where speed is recorded by the boats speedometer can not be relied on. But the national Glastron site now has a section added called "Performance" were boaters test different props and record the results. That is useful information.
Also did not try this 22" Mercury Chopper on the boat, but still have a 22" Ballistic XL, both for a Mercury. .
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Last week I found someone that tested a 23" srx. I can't find it now. He didn't like the way it revved with little acceleration out of the hole. But once it took hold it was ok
That's the nature of the beast GC. The SRX is not what one might refer to as an 'all around' prop. It was designed to for top end. No big surprize it's lacking in holeshot. Remember too the SRX is a semi-surfacing "chopper" prop, intended for elevated engine height.
Technically the holeshot is purty good, pops right outa the hole. But then of course it blows out. Not to worry, soon's ya start gaining a lil forward momentum & that sucker hooks up? It's off to the races
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Dave, You'll love this site: Prop Calculator http://www.rbbi.com/folders/prop/propcalc.htm (http://www.rbbi.com/folders/prop/propcalc.htm)
It puts your 22 (calculated at 23 w/cup at 10% slip 5600 @54'9 mph) An easy way to calculate non-slip speed: Subtract 1"from pitch (or not if cupped) x prop rpm less 3 decimals; EX: 2800 = 2.8 Your v153 was light (600-650) and narrow. Iboats lists the V162 from abt 1973 up as 15' 8". Same basic boat. It probably ran your bronze prop with less slip. I would have waited to drill the vents; 1/4-5/16" is sufficient. Too late now. My motor being stronger revs pretty good. I hope my hub is ok. The bronze 23 revs a lot. I meant for you to check the leading edge so it clears your lower skeg; that's where mine barely clears (The old Mercs were not swept back) I re-plugged my 13 7/8 x 15, re-pitched to abt 18 w/cup. I had drilled it; Started out over 4000-4500, Now 35-4000 on takeoff. Sure would like to know the specs of the 22" bronze you sold. Call the guy sometime. He might want to sell it back if his boat is too heavy. These were designed for the old pre-60's single floor boats. My first boat was a Span America with a 69 Merc 80hp. Top end was poor (40) because It had a hook from a short trailer and a 75 Johnson. That' why I got it cheap. Realized it years later.
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The prop calculator is a good check on the percentage of slip. I calculated the CVX-16 (55.0 MPH at 5,450 RPM) at 7.3% and the V-153 (53.5 MPH at 5,500 RPM) at 6.6%. The advertised weight of the CVX is 750 lbs. and the V-153 at 630 lbs. In prop tests I have read though, a prop can be fast and still have alot of slip - probably a small diameter prop.
This summer sold the 22" pitch Hi-Performance 2-blade bronze Quicksilver prop without testing it. Beautiful prop (picture of the old one). But just purchased another one new out of the box on e-bay yesterday. Just needs polishing. Heard that the motor height needs to be high for it to run right. The backup 115 HP Mercury now has a Ballistic 22" XL, the Hi-Performance 22" 2-blade bronze, and the 21" 2-blade bronze. A Laser II 22" may also work well - Gregg said he would let me test his if need be.
The 115 HP Johnson has the 20" and 22" Rakers and they seem to be excellant props. Probably exhausted the prop choices. There are the mounting the outboard higher, and shifting the fuel weight to the back (I plan on using portable gas tanks in the back) options.
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You need to find another cvx at a good price to mount your Merc on. I saw one in Omaha a few years ago without a motor. It was a 1980 same color as mine but the metalflake was large and the color was more brown. I was going to look for a 115 for it but it was soon gone. Most have been neglected and let them rot. A lot have let the upper drain hole crack and with the johnson bracket they catch water and soak the transom. I used to have dyno tests. I finally found them on the Internet at Internationaldyno.com. As someone stated the 82-88 Merc I-6 has more power, 2800, 89-93 115 has 113 ci, it's 3000 psi if I remember right . Mine is 2760 and the big block 140 , 88 and up, is less. Merc re-rated at propshaft in 82; Johnson in 85, but they may have not de-tuned until later. Any one with old engines needs to use premium. The west coast and Canada use a lot of Ethanol. I don' like to use it because of rubber parts and it absorbs water plus it runs hotter. Volvo S80 on CGOA) has his CVX 16, same as yours, David on Youtube. (About and 86) but I believe he traded for a Johnson now. About prop slip, when you get to WOT and keep trimming to raise rpm your speed may not go up, therefore more slip.
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The temptation was to keep the Glastron V-153 this spring when I purchased the CVX-16. The V-153 has more seat-of-the-pants and body english to it that is refreshing. It also seemed to go faster and have more raw exileration. The CVX-16 is more refined and handles everything in aplomb fashion. With the 1988 115 HP Merc on the V-153, for which it was intended, envisioned 56-57 MPH.
But I do not have the garage space for two boats and I am best tending to only one boat.
The 115 Merc is on a motor stand with wheels and fits okay in the front of the garage between the two cars.
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Here's a very nice boat looking for a motor. $1200 In Grand Rapids, MI. He says the transom and floor are good . Posted 12/16
I'll bet someone on this site would like to have it.
http://grandrapids.craigslist.org/boa/3448523194.html (http://grandrapids.craigslist.org/boa/3448523194.html)
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The temptation was to keep the Glastron V-153 this spring when I purchased the CVX-16. The V-153 has more seat-of-the-pants and body english to it that is refreshing. It also seemed to go faster and have more raw exileration. The CVX-16 is more refined and handles everything in aplomb fashion. With the 1988 115 HP Merc on the V-153, for which it was intended, envisioned 56-57 MPH.
But I do not have the garage space for two boats and I am best tending to only one boat.
The 115 Merc is on a motor stand with wheels and fits okay in the front of the garage between the two cars.
I hope someone like you picks up that boat in Michigan. I posted it on the Classic Glastron America Michigan site last week. I just found another 22" Quicksilver prop in Miami on Ebay today for $75. Just looked at the Tom Brown spec site at a CV-16 with a 79 140 Johnson. Post:
Glastron CV-16 1973 Evinrude 140 1984 standard OMC Raker 24 13.5 0 High on transom no no 64 Radar 6000.
Spec weight on these was 650#. This might be his boat with a modified pad and extended chines. He said in didn't help speed to extend the chines. He also tested a small ear hubless prop and got no chine walk at 72 mph. If you get thin head gaskets those old 140s ran 135-140# compression. Since you already use preimum fuel. Also, Land & Sea used to make an exhaust relief/cutout for outboards. If you fiind the forum Tom Brown is on;
(It's either B and W boats or Scream and Fly, there are some others I can't remember, Marineengine.com also) you can ask the moderator about the high comp heads or gaskets.
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GCarlover, believe we have the same prop, a Hi-Performance 13 diameter x 22 pitch 2-blade bronze, part number 48-49612. Bought mine on e-bay new in box. They are a surface prop meant to run with the outboard raised off the transom. I touched up some rough edges on the prop and polished it. Gregg may test it out this spring on his CV16 with 115 HP Mariner.
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Is that the same prop as in reply #121? It looks a differen't color. The 22" for $75 is still on Ebay as of yesterday. There also was a 24" HP listed as completed sales. It was $195 but didn't sell. It also looked more silver. They used to sell a special trim tab for the QS HP props to clear the high rake; It needs to clear on the Mercs.
Probably would on the Johnson with a longer cavitation plate. Mine (2 blade bronze) is a 13 3/4 x 23". These are the calculations from the prop test site:
Engine RPM 5700 Gear Ratio 2.00 Propeller Pitch 24(23 cup) Propeller Slip .18 Speed MPH 53 (for my bronze prop)
It also ran 48.5-49 (Clocked) at 5000 rpm (Less trim)
This is a test from 1990/91 I made with my new pickup(No GPS). Also these the same day:
The 20" Raker was 55 mph@5900.
The 22" Raker I borrowed was 55@ 5500
The 21" Michigan was 53-54 mph @ 5700-5800
On Scream & Fly Chris Lake (Laker) tells a lot about Perf mods on V-4 Loopers and also, I think on Cross-flows. Tom Brown may have posts and also someone else.
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Here is the setback trim tab made by Mercury. If you know the part number of a setback trim tab for an OMC, let me know. Gary from Canada wants to try a Laser II 22" on his Evinrude and does not know if the prop blades will clear.
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Here's a very nice boat looking for a motor. $1200 In Grand Rapids, MI. He says the transom and floor are good . Posted 12/16
I'll bet someone on this site would like to have it.
http://grandrapids.craigslist.org/boa/3448523194.html (http://grandrapids.craigslist.org/boa/3448523194.html)
120hp Johnson Evinrude V4 Rebuilt Warranty - $3400 (Minneapolis) boats - by owner Craigslist today 1/1/2013:
$3900 installed, propped and includes a one year warranty.
http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/boa/3484876168.html (http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/boa/3484876168.html)
For whoever buys the Grand Rapids Michigan boat.
Good price for a 1993 since mine(1987) retailed for over $7000 when it was new.
This one's in Melrose, MN: http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/csw/bod/3501642491.html (http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/csw/bod/3501642491.html)[/url]
Throw the seats away and check it out (new floor) They need back to back like the cv 16s anyway.
Jackplate included!
I found the one at Moses Lake:
Might be sold.
http://moseslake.craigslist.org/boa/3432239781.html (http://moseslake.craigslist.org/boa/3432239781.html)
1988 Glastron ski boat - $1700 (Moses Lake)
Date: 2012-12-06, 9:30PM PST
Reply to this post kpdtr-3432239781@sale.craigslist.org[?]
Glastron 16' ski boat.
Runs good, needs some work. Mostly upholestery and intorior.
I will do the work this winter, but price will be higher.
It's in WA for all you West Coasters.
Email, call or text Wade at 253-653-3762
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Ebay; http://www.ebay.com/itm/Michigan-Mercury-Bronze-Propeller-CUP408-Cupped-Edge-2-Blade-/300839258249?hash=item460b6ac889&item=300839258249&pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Michigan-Mercury-Bronze-Propeller-CUP408-Cupped-Edge-2-Blade-/300839258249?hash=item460b6ac889&item=300839258249&pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&vxp=mtr)
Here's a good prop for $50 for a Michigan 13 1/8 x 23.2" pitch . No hub Put your new Johnson hub in and turn down the flange. I had mine pressed in from an old prop I cut it out of. Looks like a high rake and is cupped.
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I'm going to stick with the plan of rehubbing either the 21" or 22" 2-blade bronze Mercury Quicksilver prop.
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I measured the Johnson lower unit gear case outside and inside wall diameters and the Mercury Quicksilver propeller. Both outside walls are 4". Appears that the front flange of the Mercury prop will have to be cut off so that it butts close (1/8"?) to the back of the Johnson lower unit - both 4" in diameter.
The trick will be to cut off just enough of the front prop flange after rehubbing with a Johnson hub and using a Johnson thrush washer.
May rehub both the 21" and 22" bronze props.
The props will be called "Long John Silver"
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David; This site may be helpful. Someone bought a 13 1/2 x 26 bronze for $6 over a year ago, but your number is probably a 13"dia.
http://www.boatracingfacts.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-10831.html (http://www.boatracingfacts.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-10831.html)
I just measured my flange with a calipers. Johnson is 3.790. Bronze 2 blade Prop ID is 3.740. Flange cut down is 3.800. (diff is .060/2=.030 wall) OD is 4.080
Is that right? I just corrected it. You may be able to rotate it on a large drill press. (on a 3/4" shaft on the Johnson hub) or offset the cutter on a lathe.
I wouldn't want to take a chance on cutting it off and not knowing if it is blowing out. But if you can get close to .010 clearance you might be ok. Just small exhaust bubbles that will dissipate with forward motion. The HP 2 blade prop should clear the skeg but the 21" might not.
Can't find any perf specs posted on Gregg's boat. He is running 2.07:1. A little higher rpm for the same speed. I used the prop calculator and at 5800 at 10% slip I get 54.9 mph using the 22" as 23". The Dyno pressure for Mercs are: (Check out the dyno charts I posted.) It doesn't show the 85 115 Johnson.
Use the 110hp. (2250?) 79-84 140 is 2450(hi-comp engine)
Merc 82-87 115=2800; 88-93 115=3000; 94 115=2800; 78-81 V-6 150=3150; Yours must be an 88. The chart has a typo. 4 cyl 115 came out in 1989. I just found the old books on Johnson & Merc back to 78. The last I-6 was 1988. Hope this helps. Rich
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I got 3000 but Dave still beats me on the water ....
Must be his hull ...
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The prop shop's cost to rehub a Mercury prop with a Johnson hub is $60 and to machine the front of the Mercury prop to fit against the Johnson gear case is $200.
Seems like I could rig up something to rotate the prop (with the new hub installed) while using an angle grinder to cut back the front of the prop. Maybe even putting the prop on backwards on the Johnson prop shaft.
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I might be able to have one of our techs rig it up in our lathe & trim it.
It would be alot cheaper than $200.00
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I will keep that in mind Jim. First the prop needs to be rehubbed, and then a measurement taken from a Johnson prop setup so that after cutting off the front of the prop, the gap between the Mercury prop and the Johnson gear housing is close, maybe 1/8 of an inch.
You might ask the machinist if cutting off the front of a prop is feasible.
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if you have Jim do it i have a spare prop shaft form one of my 115's you can use if that would make it easier to set up in the lathe.
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Joe, that is a great idea to put the prop on a spare Johnson propshaft. I am sure that the machinest men can take it from there. I am thinking that the best way to cut off the exact length is trial and error with the boat nearby to cut and fit until the prop clears the gearcase. Some gap between the prop and gearcase is acceptable, but the narrower the gap the better. The exhaust is not going to turn the corner and go out the gap.
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Check my reply #133. If your ID of your props read the same as mine (3.740) you will able to leave a few thousandths on the flange. If you leave a gap it will work same as a vented prop and you will get high rpm on takeoff. The two blade already acts that way. The back pressure from water behind forces it out the slot.
You would have to have a 14" lathe, so cut until it clears the housing or use your idea of mounting your grinder in a drill press vise and rotate the prop while you feed the grinder. Joes prop shaft would not fit the drill press.
I'm looking for a 26" bronze from a Scream and Fly member, but he's going to try it on his XR4 Merc. It will fit right on.
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Bought another 20" pitch Raker prop used on Craigslist and spent 3 1/2 hours getting the scratches out, sharpening the edges, and buffing it out. This hast to be my last prop. Had 14 props last spring and now down to 8.
Props for 115 HP Johnson:
Two 20" pitch Rakers - stainless steel
Two 22" pitch Rakers - stainless steel
Props for the 115 HP Mercury:
Two 21" pitch Quicksilver 2 blade - bronze
One 22" pitch Quicksilver 2 blade - bronze
One 22" pitch Ballistic - stainless steel
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if you have Jim do it i have a spare prop shaft form one of my 115's you can use if that would make it easier to set up in the lathe.
Hey Joe. You wouldn't happen to have a driveshaft kickin around? I picked up a longshaft gearcase awhile back for $100 bucks, couldn't resist. Already have a spare shift rod.
Anybody?
Funny story: When me'n Bobby Beer changed the oil & pressure tested it we discovered it had a magnet on the top plug as well as the bottom? Bobby said: I'll tell ya what if'n ya get metal on that top magnet, then ya got some real problems ...
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I do have one... But am not willing to part with it at this time, i'm actually looking for a case myself
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I do have one... But am not willing to part with it at this time, i'm actually looking for a case myself
Hmm, I just might be able to help ...
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I have a complete lower unit for early 80's evenrude/johnson and no plans for it. Came with the C-500. Never even looked inside it. I'll trade you for something in the future that I don't know I need yet.
Crebb
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that looks good guys ...
thanks
my motors are 1973, looks like they went to full mech shift in 78 (i have hydro mech)
does any one know if the newer lower will fit ?
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Props for the 115 HP Mercury:
Two 21" pitch Quicksilver 2 blade - bronze
One 22" pitch Quicksilver 2 blade - bronze
One 22" pitch Ballistic - stainless steel
David,
Hang on to the 22P Ballistic, I would like to try it this spring!
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I would like to try the 22" pitch Quicksilver 2 blade - bronze.
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Hey Doug, I looked earlier today for those drive shafts I thought I saw over the weekend, just couldn't find'em. I'm going back and will take more light this time.
Terry
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Jim and Gregg, yes I will hang onto those props for your testing. Gregg, the 22" bronze will be interesting to try. I have tried both the 20" and 22" pitch Hi-performance 2-blade bronze on the V-153 many years ago with an 80 HP Merc and the prop did not perform. Think it performs better with the motor off the transom.
Jim, believe you should be looking at a 19" to 20" pitch prop - a 20" Laser II or a 19" Ballistic. 21" pitch was just right for my 115 HP Merc on the V-153, but that is a much lighter boat than your 17 footer.
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Have given up on converting a Mercury 2-blade bronze prop to a Johnson prop. The OMC Raker 22" runs 55.0 MPH GPS and might be the fastest prop. But other good props are a Ballistic 21 or a Lightspeed 22. While searching on the internet for comparisions between these three props, one source said that the Raker was a better prop than either the Ballistic or OMC SST. Another said the Ballistic had good bow lift while the Raker had excellent bow lift. I have run the Ballistic 21 and the Lightspeed (Laser II 20 and 22) on my Glastron V-153 and know the general charactistics of each prop. My CVX-16 needs bow lift.
I ordered a new Lightspeed 13.5 x 22 and will try it out this spring. The Lightspeeds are known to keep the bow high. The part number is QS5142H and I believe it comes with a hub kit, Flo-Torq II hub kit for a Johnson V4 #835266Q 1.
Laser II is the Mercury brand, and Lightspeed is the Quicksilver brand, but they are basically the same.
The Laser II's come with round interchangeable various diameter vinyl vent hole inserts, while the Lightspeed has a fixed retangular vent hole, like the original style of the Laser II. I have seen satin and polished finishes on Lightspeed.
Told my wife again that this will be the last prop I buy - this is number 10.
.
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I'm not trying to compare apples to oranges but on my cvx 18 I love the 23p turbo I have. I've tried a few others and that one really airs that boat out. Again, I/O vs outboard. But that same prop sucks tons of air on my intimidator. That boat loves my cleaver in 23p. Absolutely no cavitation in the corners.
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I predict you'll be very happy with the Lightspeed David. It'll give ya a buncha bow lift. I reckon it'll produce about the same top end as your Raker.
Do you recall way back when our V153s were tied neck & neck @52.9? Believe you were running a Raker & I a Lightspeed. Btw 5142 is the correct part #, as is your Flo-Torq hub #.
Hey if you ever have to lie to Joy, again, tell her an SRX will be the last prop you'll buy. That's the one conspicuosly missing from yer collection nowadays.
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Doug, thanks for the kind words. Back when we were both running 52.9 MPH, I was using a 2-blade bronze 21" Mercury Quicksilver. I do not know what to expect from the Lightspeed, but I had to find out. The blades are bigger than those of the Raker. You should try a Raker on your Baja. A 24" for you might be better than a 22". I intend to try a SRX somehow someday by borrow, buy, or trade.
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Dave, Both of these fit V4 OMC....the RX has been worked and runs real strong. You are welcome to try them if you like, send me a pm or stop by the store.
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These will fit as well.............
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Don, check your e-mail.
David
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These will fit as well.............
Ooh! I want the pointy one. Looks like it'd take a Manatees head clean off ...?
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Here's a post from Iboats I just found. You need to hang that Merc David. The post is 1971 115 vs 135.
Reply by CroSSed: (VERY nice. Here's mine. I have an '87 115; basically the same thing as a '77 1500 with slight de-tuning; probably makes the same hp as yours. I gps'd this with a 22P Laser II at just under 57 mph. Where do you boat? It would be fun to see how fast we each are..)
Don't know the boat.
TG
Attached Thumbnails
http://forums.iboats.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=5044&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1187841226 (http://forums.iboats.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=5044&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1187841226)
Here's another by Scatty:
Heres a few pix!First of my Guru in the same boat as mine, with the XS.
Second 2 of my XS in the 70's, 17 foot Switzercraft, on the pad at 72mph. 14x28 2 blade surface prop (Yep, JR, some boats we never should have sold!!)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v610/Robby6950/SwitzerRoostertail.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v610/Robby6950/SwitzerRoostertail.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/SwitzerRoostertail_zps22f38eea.jpg)
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I have heard conflicting reports as to whether the 1988 115 HP Merc (the 140 HP of previous years) or the 1985 115 HP Johnson (the 140 of previous years) has more horsepower. Right now I am hitting 55.0 GPS with a Raker 22" with the motor 3/4" off the transom. Canadian Glastroner with the same CVX16 with a 1987 115 HP Merc with a 22" Laser II and motor high was running 53.8 MPH and now has switched to a Johnson. I will be trying Lightspeed 22" and SRX 23" props this spring.
It would be nice to just switch outboards as easiily as unbolting one prop and bolting another one on in the same day. But there are a bunch of connections with switching and many man hours to get it right. Both Johnson and Mercury make excellent products. In my opinion, there is not a clear advantage of one brand over the other.
The intent now is to stick with the Johnson and focus on fine tuning such as engine height, props, weight to the back, and new steering system.
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The Dyno specs for the 77-80 Merc 140 is 2350
82-87 115 @ 5000 are 2800
88-93 115hp Merc is 3000.
94 up 115hp Merc 2800 (2.07:1)
The 150 and 150XS are not shown.
85 115 Johnson is not shown
The old 140 Johnson shows 2450 @ 5000.
The 150 and 150XS are not shown. I posted the Dyno site earlier but it is the only one and errors are
possible. Does anyone know the LU ratio for the Merc 1500 (2:1?)or 1500 XS ?.
I think it was Terry Fritz who had a hot 100 hp Evinrude. Feel free to chime in if I have that right.
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Dave
Even if the LU's didn't add speed ... They sure look cool !
Some where in this site are dyno specs for JohnRudes & Merc's ...
Chris is a "Mod" on this site (Glastron-GT160) . He gos by Merc_Nut here .
http://www.themarinedoctor.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl (http://www.themarinedoctor.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl)
Not sure what the numbers mean ?
Is it the pressure (PSI) put out at the prop with a water wheel thingy on the prop shaft ?
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The top one has a cone kit from Land and sea circa 1978 (I bought it new).......The other offers "how bad do you want it" speed..........these cases can be run without a water pump (parasitic drag) to gain a horsepower or two, drive as follows......start...go wide open....stop......LOL..........I pulled both these motors off boats I sold last fall and put them in storage. I am getting rid of everything but........(just in case)......... The Black Stack From Fond Du Lac VS The V4's from OMC ? I don't know, Is one more fun than the other?
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/mmwabsffdlm150_zps3a217467.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/mbaswosoev115_zps9b443597.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/Cap064_zpse9fa39e7.jpg)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/e70scmwabsffdl115_zpsa62b9714.jpg)
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Personally I prefer the way a V sounds vs an inline. No offense! Plus I think ya kin wind em up a lil tighter?
When I was young'n rich I had the opportunity to drive a Ferrari 308 GT4. Not to sound fos but when you wind these crossflows up they sound the same way. Kinda like a giant chainsaw ...?
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Did a search of horsepower tests of outboards, but found no hard numbers of Johnson vs. Mercury. Even if we did find them, there is also the design and efficiency of the lower unit. Found stuff like the motors that were under the advertised horsepower and the high performance motors from each line that pushed the limits of being at the edge of +10 percent of the advertised horsepower. Mercury advertised that its 250 HP motor was really 275 HP. Seems like the hard numbers are a secret from the public. But outboard motor hop up shops would know the numbers, since the stock engine is dynometered before the hop up to measure the horsepower change from the base HP.
Wish there were some boat magazine tests where they would take identical boats (adjusted with weights as the identical boats had surprising weight differences) and put stock motors of 115 HP from Mercury, Johnson, Yamaha and let the motor manufacturer choose the prop. Then record the stats - top speed, 0 to various speeds, gas mileage, noise levels, price.
Wish someone had done this in the 1985 to 1988 time period.
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Received the Mercury Quicksilver Lightspeed 13 1/2 x 22" prop today and compared it to the Raker 13 1/2 x 22". First of all, a Laser II will not work because the Lightspeed has the hub machined down to the correct outside diameter to fit inside the gearcase of the Johnson. The differences between the two props are evident. The Lightspeed has blades with more area because the blades are longer and extent further back at the hub. The Lightspeed has more cupping in the blades from the hub area to the tips. The Lightspeed blades are one great sweep whereas the Raker has a bend. Received also the hub kit to fit it to a OMC motor. Plan to test both this spring. This is my last prop.
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" This is my last prop. "
HA HA ... YA right Dave ... LOL
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" This is my last prop. "
HA HA ... YA right Dave ... LOL
That's what he tells his wife too ...
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The Dyno specs for the 77-80 Merc 140 is 2350
82-87 115 @ 5000 are 2800
88-93 115hp Merc is 3000.
94 up 115hp Merc 2800 (2.07:1)
The 150 and 150XS are not shown.
85 115 Johnson is not shown
The old 140 Johnson shows 2450 @ 5000.
The 150 and 150XS are not shown. I posted the Dyno site earlier but it is the only one and errors are
possible. Does anyone know the LU ratio for the Merc 1500 (2:1?)or 1500 XS ?.
I think it was Terry Fritz who had a hot 100 hp Evinrude. Feel free to chime in if I have that right.
The attached pages are from the 1977 Mercury Brochure, show the specs for the1500 and the xs......also in this catalog is the Black Max XS......I have the manuels that came with my original K&O dyno (early model 2000) I still have the Dyno as well(its my home garage Dyno).....I will check my spec sheets to see what models I might have. Seems to me somewhere I heard 165 HP for an XS somewhere long ago....but my memory is as old as I am. Also some in the 70's said Mercury would rate below real horsepower (a 90 might make 100-110 horsepower) to make them outperform the competition.....Again my old memory at work.....anybody else ever heard that? By the way Terry, the Hydrostream Viking I got from you has a new core, set up single seat center steer with a 225 Mercury and is set to debut this spring on the local lakes.
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Here is a six prop test from 1989......The Mach magnum looks to be the fastest......They came from Second Effort (OMC factory race center) and I think they made them to fit V4 gearcases.........
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two more pages
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Circa 1978....Michigan Wheel.....It looks like the "PR" series was made for V4 OMC, Looks a bit like a Mercury Chopper......I have never seen one of these but looks like it might be fun to try.
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Don, thanks for reproducing the article on testing six different props on a 20-foot ski boat that allowed bow lift powered by a 200 HP Evinrude. The test occured on October of 1989, before the introduction of the OMC Raker, OMC SRX and a host of good aftermarket props. The article points out the important of a jack plate to lower and raise the motor to get the right height to balance the advantage of lower unit out of the water to cut resistance, limited at higher heights by ventilation of the prop under acceleration and hard turns. Each prop has its ideal height. The article points out that the only way to find out the best prop is by testing them. Also, finding the best prop is the cheapest way to increase speed, handling and gas mileage.
In my case, on the Glastron/Carlson CVX-16, I have tested an OMC SS II, an OMC Viper, and an OMC Raker. The Raker is 1-1/2 miles faster than the other two props. The Raker ventilates under acceleration and hard turns which may be caused by a gap between the prop and lower unit case which causes gases to exit over the hub. If significant, there are sealing rings available to attach to the front of the prop causing less exhaust gases to escape and create the mix of water and air. I have heard of this complaint with other Raker users. Maybe the front of the prop just needs minor sealing by layers of duct tape or electrical tape. I also may close off the vent holes with little plastic caps or silicon glue. I have the feeling that the Lightspeed can be run at higher transom heights than the Raker, being more of a surface prop. But without a jack plate, it is hard to experiment.
The main point of the article is that if you settle for the prop that came with the boat, you are probably using a less than ideal prop.
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Yeah that's good stuff RP, thanks! A lil dated I reckon but the truths still ring true.
Yo David, my Lightspeed's perfectly happy 2" high. No problemo. You need to raise that motor a lil, imo.
Then get an SRX ... That one Don has looks purty killer?
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Here is a page from OMC circa 1983 regarding SST series props
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David, attached is a long tube 2 blade 133/4 x21 v4 prop It is Aluminum but runs quite well, I thinned the blades and added as much cup as I thought the blades could withstand without cracking also not using a converging ring. This may be interesting to test as well, it is shown next to an SST for comparison. The prop was built by Michigan wheel in the 70's or 80's.......last I ran it was on a Marlin Scorpion (640 lbs) with a 115 Johnson, I think top speed was either 55 or 58......my old memory again.
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Don, interesting design of the long tubes. Michigan made some unusual designs. They were one of the first to add vent holes on the hub. They also had a 2-blade bronze series that some swear by that looked like the Mercury Hi-performance props (attached photo). Like they say, you never know what works until you try it. I also have thinned the blades on a Raker 22" (attached photo) and ran it against a stock Raker 22", but there was no difference in MPH. There are those that also rough up the trailing edges of the blades - you see this on Mercury cleavers - supposed to loosen up the water as it exits the blade and create less suction. Read an article of the history of props and the outstanding ones, the Mercury Chopper is one of the ones that come to mind (attached photo).
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I agree with the rough surface.......Here is the bottom of my Carlson Challenger. Running surface is Black Gel-kote sanded with 600 grit. I think it helps break the surface tension and the boat does not "stick" to the water as much= less friction, more speed.......
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This is from the 1978 OMC accessory catalog.......The Silver Streak was metallic Silver paint, came in over the hub and through hub versions. I ran an over the hub version back then (I traded it in about 1983 for a set of 15x39x15 Firestone mud tires). The catalog featured "how a prop works" and if you look close you will see that the 2 blade Bronze High Performance props are still available, these are cool but hard to find..............
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This from the 1980 Catalog, now Teflon coated and called the SST II over the hub. The two blade Bronze are no longer available in 1980, checking the part number it supercedes to 3 blade stainless. David, I know you said no more props but..........suppose you found a couple of the Bronze two blades for your V4?
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From the 1982 Catalog....now it is the SST RX.
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Circa 1976, The Bicenntenial....what a year......anyway now the SST has only been out for a couple years and the 2 Blade Bronze is still a good choice for a Hot Rod. This is also the introductory year for OMC's V6 engine (The 200) and the Mercury Black Max 175. Attached is a page from the December 1975 issue of Powerboat Magazine with some of the new motors for 1976. Volvo Penta is still making Outboards at this time, I remember way back we serviced them and I think we got parts from Borton Volvo (The car dealer).
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This is a kinda neat idea for testing props.
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glad to hear the hydrostream will be back on the water this year.that was a nice boat.did you find use for that jackplate?
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By the way Terry, the Hydrostream Viking I got from you has a new core, set up single seat center steer with a 225 Mercury and is set to debut this spring on the local lakes.
[/quote]
225!?
How come no pics? Come on, I'd love to see it. BTW I know you've been doing this stuff for a long time and I got that Viper from you...last time I was at Express Composites they told me they sell "core kits" for Hydrostreams. Did you do a transom as well? Is that what you did or did you fab your own?
I thought you were retired. LOL
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I will get a couple photos of the Stream to you once the lakes thaw, I think I am going to go with David for some prop testing and guess my wife will be taking photos so maybe I will run the Viking then. the Allison plate made its way to my Pacecraft. Ross, I have always made my own stuff......keep in mind I have "helpers"......I have done cores in Balsa, plywood (flat areas....tunnel boats) and just in Combo mat. My Challenger is done with only combo mat replacing the balsa core. I have done transoms several different ways as well, maybe I should stop by for a beer or 3 and we can discuss? I will get some photos up.
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Anytime. The Viper is down kinda low on the list. Being unemployed gives me the time but not the funds. I do want to get to it within a year or so. Been thinking about it more lately and thinking (dreaming) about what I'd put on it for power. I think a 150 on there would be enough to soil my shorts?
I knew/figured you did all your own stuff but wondered if you knew they had a kit and had any experience with it.
Sorry David. Its your thread.
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Don, thought about OMC bronze 2-blade props for awhile. The part numbers are 384140 and 384141, both 21" pitch with diameters of 13 7/8 and 12 3/4, one of them cupped, both no longer made. But abandoned the idea because they have no or little rake, which I need for the CVX-16. Considered converting a Mercury Hi-Performance 22" 2-blade bronze to OMC hub, but the prop worked best according to Mercury Marine with engine height 5" above the transom, too high for me.
People have converted this Hi-Performane Mercury prop to OMC (picture on Fiberclassics "Ponyboy") but not tested yet. Also a Mercury Chopper on Craigslist for sale in another city of a Mercury Chopper on OMC hub.
Thinking between my presently owned Rakers, Lightspeed, and your SRX we are close to the best prop.
Picture of a OMC bronze prop.
Don, if you have a OMC 2-blade bronze, it sure would be worth a try.
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Did anybody else catch the line about it taking 15 more HP to increase top end by 3MPH?
This appears to be a fairly accurate claim, least in my case. Going from the '86 90 to the '83 140 upped top end by 8.1 mph.
I doubt the formula holds true once ya get into the way upper echelon, but it is interesting that it seems to be fairly accurate for our style of boats/motors?
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That formula is about right with my old Glastron V-153. Added 35 HP going from 80 HP to 115 HP to increase speed from 44 to 53 MPH.
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HMMMMMMM, based on 15 hp=3 mph I am going to need about another 300 HP or so............Attached..... the slip calculator and the cup gauge from Mercury Marine circa 2000........how many more weeks until prop testing?
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Don, from what I've seen of your fast boats, you have nothing to worry about.
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Got the boat out of storage today. Wanted to know if the Lightspeed (Mercury Prop) would actually fit on a Jonhson, since it takes a special hub kit, a thinner thrust washer, and the front of the prop is machined down to fit inside the Johnson gear case. It fits - blades clear the torque tab, the prop is short enough so that the cotter pin fits through the prop shaft, and the front of the prop does not rub against the gear case. So far so good. Testing when the ice melts is next.
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Yer gonna luv that prop David.
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Sweet, can't wait for the results!
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Did anybody else catch the line about it taking 15 more HP to increase top end by 3MPH?
This appears to be a fairly accurate claim, least in my case. Going from the '86 90 to the '83 140 upped top end by 8.1 mph.
I doubt the formula holds true once ya get into the way upper echelon, but it is interesting that it seems to be fairly accurate for our style of boats/motors?
The 86 90 would be same as an 83 115 hp.
Was going to post a good deal on 86 Mariner 115 for $1000. Too late, sold in one day. Had 148 psi comp. Definitely a premium burner:
115 Mariner Motor - Craigslist
1 day ago ... I have my 1986 115hp Mariner outboard for sale. Comes with all throttle and shift controls including a brand new steering cable, steering wheel ...
omaha.craigslist.org/boa/3767736983.html
Someone from Des Moines wants a 115 to 200 in good shape.
The blades look thin on the Lightspeed; If you get more bow lift speed will increase. Don't know how you stop the chinewalk David.
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Working on a Chine Walk solution for a CV 16? Way back on non pad Vee bottoms we used trim tabs to add stability/handling most often in line with the strakes. The Scorpion with the V6 is using them as well as a big pitch cleaver to help minimize bow lift. LOL That boat was pretty fast for the crowd on Lake Owasso back in the late 70's...........The only boat I remember seeing the Transom on was Terry Huberty (Paramount Marine) with 200 OMC on a Hydrostream Ventura....... well anyway back then we used tabs to help the handling. I don't know if it would work on a CV 16 hull?
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I have the same trim tabs as the picture but mounted them flush with bottom of the boat. They are in line and just extend the length w/o tipping downward. Might have been better w/o cutting the bottom off and mounting higher than the transom bottom. Check out the picture under: Page one http://forum.cgoamn.com/index.php?topic=3779.0 (http://forum.cgoamn.com/index.php?topic=3779.0) Mine is a CVX 16. Motor mounting is set back 1" and up 3/4 to 1". Steering is tight. I shimmed out the play in the rack and pinion.
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So far no chine walk problems with the CVX-16 with the two types of SST II props nor with the 20" or 22" Raker props. Not even with the motor tilted back to the extreme. We will see what happens with the Quicksilver Lightspeed (same as Laser II) which has alot of bow lift. The pad has a 1/16" to 1/8" hook in it. Have not checked the stakes of the CVX-16 for straightness yet.
When Gregg tested the Ballistic 22 XL and the Power Tech 22" on his CV-16, there was alot of porposing.
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I stated earlier mine porpoised until I set back 1". That brought the mounting down about 1/4". Others have said less chinewalk when mounted higher. I also seem to have a slight hook in the pad. My boat has no ski locker and no side storage. (50 lbs less) Going to use the Mich 13". It was a little high before and cavitated on turns but the trim tabs seem to contribute to that. Less twisting torque. Also will test the bronze 23" and bring it up slowly so as not to lose bow lift. We have a fourty mph limit so I have to be careful who I complain about on other issues.
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Fyi, Frankm on the national site claimed there was some chine-walk in his CVX16ss after 55mph. His build of putting a 302 V8 into a CVX16ss was what I used for reference in my build. The handling of the outboard version might give you an advantage over that though, because you can move the prop/motor around a lot more. I've gotten my CVX16ss up right to that 50mph mark and it was still stable, but it felt very "light" on the water also. It will be interesting to me to see if I see similar results with props as you do as I progress because of the different drives.
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Here's one for ya Dave! It will keep you polishing and filing until next winter!
http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/dak/boa/3745657055.html (http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/dak/boa/3745657055.html)
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Ross, I'm tempted to buy it, polish it, and try it on the Johnson 115 HP. May have to modify the lower unit of the Johnson to get it to fit.
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From Yamaha's March edition of "Prop Shop"...........Go up in pitch AND rpm..........
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Hay Don ...
Was nice to finally meet you ...
and to not have to turn your picture right side up ...
... LOL
After we putting my motor on your dyno , I think I should be able to top Dave's CVX speed by 8 mph on gps ...
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The thing is I never know how they will land????? Its an accident when they are right side up so thanks for fixin them. Nice to meet you, looking forward to some testing this spring with both those boats.......I wonder if a CV16 or aCVX16 will run faster????
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I'm just "Pullin' Dave's chain" Don ... LOL
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well alright, but I still say hooking the nitrous into your existing primer system would be really cool.............
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I talked to Joe on the telephone at Hannay's today about Teleflex steering systems. Joe was very helpful and informative. Started to take my present Teleflex rack and pinion steering off the boat after putting on thermo underwear. Of course, you take the driver's seat out and then look at the underside wood that you must sand and preserve. So then I go to Home Depot for some wood seal and preservative. Will take the steering to Joe when it is out for cable length fitting for the NFB rack and pinion, maybe Xtreme cable, and end fittings.
Gregg, with your motor mounted higher, the Laser II will work much better. Then we have the other props to try on your motor. Who knows which boat will end up the fastest. Your welcome to come along for the testing. Don has hinted at some secret props to test collected over the years.
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Dave
The weather is on my side at least ... To cold to go boating even if it was done ... LOL
Give me a "heads up" when you guys go ...
Don you said you won't tell Dave about the nitrous ...
Least ya didn't tell him about the other three speed secrets ...
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I saw that - one of the speed secrets that was posted, an engine block on the bench, then deleted. Is that fair? May have to buy Jerry Sellner's Evinrude V-8 and put on the CVX-16.
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HMMMMMM We may have to move this over to the CV16 Then. This could get interesting, the battle of the 100 MPH CV's !!!!!!!
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We had better change the CV vs. CVX speed challege from White Bear Lake to the St. Croix River. WBL has a 35 MPH speed limit.
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We may need some higher pitch props with the 300's on the CV's........LOL
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I think Dave has a few big wheels left from his V-153 motor testing ...
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/BIG%20motors/59855_pankonin_verado300_zps2845ae1f.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/BIG%20motors/59855_pankonin_verado300_zps2845ae1f.jpg.html)
I got rid of all my Yamaha props ...
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/BIG%20motors/59850_GlastronV_156_Vmax_zps5801db9e.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/BIG%20motors/59850_GlastronV_156_Vmax_zps5801db9e.jpg.html)
Brian went back to one motor and has a few OMC props left ...
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/BIG%20motors/60006_59895_GT_20150_20013_zps4c780ed3.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/BIG%20motors/60006_59895_GT_20150_20013_zps4c780ed3.jpg.html)
Chris sold his GT and got a SeaRay ...
We don't talk to him any more ....
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/BIG%20motors/59836_GT_160_VMax_zps8bc2df69.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/BIG%20motors/59836_GT_160_VMax_zps8bc2df69.jpg.html)
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I regret selling the V-153 with the 300 Mercury outboard. What an adrenaline rush. Passed more than one Allison. Was tempted to trailer it to Florida to go head to head with Doug Campbell.
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Reminds me of the guys I saw prop testing last summer, they had a pontoon with a 350 verado on it. Those props were HUGE, the guy was carrying it with both hands.
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Hyper, Am I supposed to keep this quiet too?
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DOG GONE IT Don ....
Ya might as well give Dave all our secrets ...
... LOL
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Don, I thought you were on my payroll, not Gregg's. I had better inspect closely any prop of yours you let me test. - may be a left hand prop rather than a right hand prop.
Might as well tell some of my secrets:
Small fuel tank now located under the spashwell
Front seats and Ski container removed - driving from a camp stool
Engine started by a rope to omit the weight of the battary
Prop modified and blades thinned by DAH in Wisconsin
Windshield removed
Boat hardware removed
Went on a crash diet and dropped in weight from 195 to a lean/mean 165
Winning isn’t everything; it’s the only thing.
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How do you find time to lose weight in the MN winter? I know you had a lot of snow.
I thought that V 153 was photo shopped. You actually had that setup?
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Gregg.............You better stop eating until after the speed trials I think and we may have to sand the deck of your boat until it is like tissue paper to get down to competitive weight?????? I do think the new powerhead with 4 two barrels will help a lot though.
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Don, I can see I'm fighting an uphill battle. Do you have any boats for sale?
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David, Would you consider going back to Black?............In Line Six, six carbs, a little loud but making an honest 200 horsepower with the in line weight. With this you might be able to put the windshield back on???
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/don200inline6bamother1_zpse0ff37e4.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/don200inline6bamother1_zpse0ff37e4.jpg.html)
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Or......... maybe something like this?
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/donspickelforkflamedbullet2_zps18177e9b.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/donspickelforkflamedbullet2_zps18177e9b.jpg.html)
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Looks sweet...even sideways Don. LOL
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or ... maybe this :)
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Don, you're back on my payroll. Let's put that 200 HP in-line six Mercury on the CVX-16. Bet we hit in the upper 60's MPH with a 26" Mercury Chopper and beat everyone in the Minnesota crowd, including Jeff, Shawn, and Tim. Kip and Scott have untried hopped up motors, but betcha we could beat them too.
The Okahoma crowd is a different story. They have inboards with all those cubic inches.
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How do you find time to lose weight in the MN winter? I know you had a lot of snow.
I thought that V 153 was photo shopped. You actually had that setup?
In the winter time a few years back, Chris S photoshopped big outboards on a few of our boats. The V-153 was rated for a 90 HP motor, and with a 115 HP Merc went 53 MPH and that was plenty fast for that small 630 pound boat. The photos keep coming back to be used for silly times. I am on a constant diet, but can not lose weight.
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Is everyone as gullible? Gregg and the other guys did the same. Can't see the 600 lb engine on a 630 lb boat unless you had jack stands under it . I saw an ad for a boat and trailer that way cause the tire was flat in another pic. I'm working on the weight thing. Maybe no chine walking when I was 30 lbs less.
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Real or photoshop ?
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/bob%20twin%20V8s/bob3_zps560f237d.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/bob%20twin%20V8s/bob3_zps560f237d.jpg.html)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/bob%20twin%20V8s/bob1_zpsa421155e.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/bob%20twin%20V8s/bob1_zpsa421155e.jpg.html)
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/bob%20twin%20V8s/bob2_zps06fb054d.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/bob%20twin%20V8s/bob2_zps06fb054d.jpg.html)
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GT 160? Haven't seen that pic before. How fast if it's real?
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Purty sure it's real. Top speed is 'classified' ...
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Its Real CV21 belongs to Bob Probst has twin LS1 motors 550hp a side.
He did all the everything except the gel coat.
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The Dyno specs for the 77-80 Merc 140 is 2350
82-87 115 @ 5000 are 2800
88-93 115hp Merc is 3000.
94 up 115hp Merc 2800 (2.07:1)
The 150 and 150XS are not shown.
85 115 Johnson is not shown
The old 140 Johnson shows 2450 @ 5000.
The 150 and 150XS are not shown. I posted the Dyno site earlier but it is the only one and errors are
possible. Does anyone know the LU ratio for the Merc 1500 (2:1?)or 1500 XS ?.
I think it was Terry Fritz who had a hot 100 hp Evinrude. Feel free to chime in if I have that right.
Here are specs including in line 150's.........I have spec books for all outboard brands as well as I/O brands........If anybody is curious where their motor/drive specs let me know and I will post it if I have it.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/Scan131260000_zps25e19e95.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/Scan131260000_zps25e19e95.jpg.html)
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Indoor Boating.......V4 OMC at 5500 on the Dyno. Hyper, what pitch are you running on the Mariner?
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Is everyone as gullible? Gregg and the other guys did the same. Can't see the 600 lb engine on a 630 lb boat unless you had jack stands under it . I saw an ad for a boat and trailer that way cause the tire was flat in another pic. I'm working on the weight thing. Maybe no chine walking when I was 30 lbs less.
The 300 Suzuki on the Hyrostream is real but never went in the water........The boat is set to debut this summer with a much lighter 225 Mercury. I am sure the v-8 Corinthian has been run that way and I suspect Ole Reds tunnel is for real.....by the way Red I missed out on the Hendrickson, I talked to him but before I could figure out how to get it to Minnesota one of the guys on Scream n Fly grabbed it. I am still looking for a Skat craft kneel down race tunnel (I ran one in the 70's/80's)....The Hendrickson was a duplicate if you ever see another...........
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Lazer II 22P ...
Story is here ...
http://forum.cgoamn.com/index.php?topic=3265.0 (http://forum.cgoamn.com/index.php?topic=3265.0)
Plan to go to second hole up from bottom when I mount motor tomorrow night.
I have a water pressure gauge, that I'll install ... Thanks Kip !
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Retro, Did you remember the psi and the yr Johnson? The 79-84 140 shows 2450; 80-84 115 - 2250; 90 up 115 - 2300; 87 140 - 2750 but that's with 2.15 gears; 88 - 2425 to 2500. Lower gears, more torque.
1980 CVX is restoring on the other site - Carlson projects. Planning on a 89 Johnson 200GT 450 lbs. What do you think?
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Yes Gregg there was a CL pic I posted for David a while back. Michigan high-rake 2 blade 23 w/o a hub. The old no rake bronze won't clear the new skegs. Mine (13 1/2 x 23) is so close on the Johnson I use another 1/8" washer. Scary but seems to work. Might be causing cavitation on the take off. I posted your 22" bronze a few min ago. Is it accurate?
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Retro, Did you remember the psi and the yr Johnson? The 79-84 140 shows 2450; 80-84 115 - 2250; 90 up 115 - 2300; 87 140 - 2750 but that's with 2.15 gears; 88 - 2425 to 2500. Lower gears, more torque.
1980 CVX is restoring on the other site - Carlson projects. Planning on a 89 Johnson 200GT 450 lbs. What do you think?
[/quote
2000 model.....making about 2100....ignition failing periodically and dropping to about 1000.....parts are on order....we'll see how it does after repair.......CVX 16 with a 200? I don't know.....might be a handfull to drive.......well...........maybe. I have not been on the other site.
Hulls under 650 lbs with V6 power........What a Rush..........
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Sidewinder on a Glastron site! I like. I was tempted to get one. A few were here in NE back in the seventies. We used to go to DeSoto Bend by Blair. They closed it to power boaters and swimmers mainly because of goose droppings, I heard. Saw a Tahiti pull up 3 slalom skiers. Need to post on the Sidewinder Boats site. 18' or 16? I'll go look.
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(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/CGOAMNpic2/donsidewinderft70s231_zps63a21b56.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/CGOAMNpic2/donsidewinderft70s231_zps63a21b56.jpg.html)
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The 16' Tahiti was a low buck screamer......solid but ugly......ran it summer 2010 then bolted an 85 on it and sold it.........the second one is a Marlin Scorpion with a 175 circa 1977.......still have the boat now running a 135 (same as when new) the hull is 1973 and it was repowered with the 175 in 1977 Then back to V4 in the 80's...........The third is a 1972 MX15 Checkmate with a strong 2.0 Liter Mercury, still have it and still run it....Both Marlin and Tahiti were named along with a bunch of others when Sidewinder sued for the 16SS Hull being splashed. The Checkmate is the lightest and is real enthusiastic...........Sorry, I am off the Glastron path. I just love talking boats :)
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The Tahiti I saw was a Low pro w/ jet drive. Beautiful lavender color. I found a list posted, I think on the SW site. The first 2 yrs Low pro was 15' 10" x 77 wt 650 rated 135 hp. 18 ft wt 800. After 71 they rated 150hp on both models. I think 50 lbs more for the Deluxe. Somebody clocked with a 115 or 140 at 53 mph.
We can talk about this while David is trying to get his new prop on. And adjust his new steering setup.
I posted Tom Brown's tests on the other site. 77 CVX 16 w/ 200hp XRI 24 chopper 72mph 5 1/2 setback high transom. Rpm possibly 6500 , no tach. Prop calc shows .008 slip. No chine walk at that height. 1980 CVX is planning a Johnson 200hp 450 lbs (under Carlson projects).
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I do not usually run Speedometers or measure speed..........I just go by either you are ahead or you are behind :D
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Just had a conversation with my neighbor, the Ex MN. with a 78 CVX 16. Drag raced someone when he had a 70 Chevelle and pulled his trailered boat at 120 mph. I told him it was 5 under the CVX record.
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Purchased a new SRX OMC prop 13 3/4" x 22" pitch prop mainly for the Johnson raised one or two more holes on the transom since it is a surface prop. Over the hub exhaust but acceleration from dead stop seems fairly good judging from Don Larkey's SRX prop. Blades are very sharp.
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Is that the one Doug loves ?
Look fast just sittin' there !
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This is the prop Doug Cambell runs. His is modified to 24" pitch.
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You might consider a jackplate like Belwoodlaker67 has: http://www.classicglastron.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=8709&p=52315#p52315 (http://www.classicglastron.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=8709&p=52315#p52315)
Need to ask if he had installed it. Can you clear the steering at two inches up? Your motor and prop needs to go back to get more water into it without blowing out. That Jackplate is only 3" back so it might work with your new steering set up.
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going back 3" and up 2" you end up with the prop almost as deep in the water as it was.
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Plans are to figure out if I should move the motor up one or two holes. Want to have high water pressure under all conditions. No jackplate. Then with the motor higher, test the SRX 22 against the Raker 22 and the Lightspeed 22. Moving the motor up the 3/4 or 1 1/2 inches, respectively, for the one or two holes might change the mix of what is the best prop. The SRX 22 might be the fun prop - rooster tail, prop for light loads, and the Raker 22 the work horse. Goal is to reach 57 MPH. The Lightspeed I believe can be converted back to Mercury use by a filler ring at the front of the hub, and the use of a Mercury hub kit.
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This is the prop Doug Cambell runs. His is modified to 24" pitch.
Ya but mine ain't near as purty as yours David. Are you sure it's a 22? As most were 23. What's the part #? I thought you'd already run a SRX on that rig, or am I losing my marbles ...
If yer gonna go up, go all the way. The SRX will love you for it! And your other props won't mind, my Lightspeed has no problems at that height.
re. Water pressure: I've never had a serious problem with low water pressure/overheating. Though I will admit the 90 on the 153 would trip the high temp alarm every once in awhile if'n ya were runnin it hard, but that was summer when the water's 90 deg & the air's even hotter. I doubt that'll be a problem for you Dave, go for it!
You will experience a lil more "blow out" coming outa the hole, but imo it's a small price to pay for the increase in mid range acceleration & top end. When set up right this prop'll take your breath away.
re. Rooster tail: For an outboard your rooster tail should be no higher than the top of yer motor. Sure big high one's look really cool, but yer just wasting thrust.
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Doug, thanks for the information. You are correct, it is a 23" pitch - I knew that. Part number 390750. The small hub for the V-4's came in 23" pitch only, the larger hub for the V-6's came in 25, 27 and 29 - maybe a 23, I'm not sure.
Yes, I tried a fellow Glastron's SRX 23" and it was slower than the 22 Raker, but the prop had been modified. I want to try a new one with sharp blades to see if I can improve on the Raker's top speed. Probably will try it on the lower motor height shortly for a bench mark, and raise the motor and take another reading. The SRX I tried before had good bow lift.
Doug, you should try a Raker 24" pitch. Bet it is only slightly slower than an SRX and more versatile at the slower speeds. A 24" Raker should be cheap since not many boats can swing that high of a pitch.
The prop collection is at 9 props right now, and I would like to sell off three. The SRX was expensive. My wife said "Merry Christmas" when I showed it to her.
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We tested 2 props today from my neighbor with a 91 115 on my 140hp. 12 3/4 x21 AL cupped and 12 3/4 x 23 SST I. Temp today 90. Both ran almost the same top end ; SST @6000 51.6 gps. Two in the boat. Alum 5800 51.3 gps. 5600 50mph speedo (gps was 50.4). TomCVX says he ran 53 mph gps @ 5300 w/Alum 21 must be incorrect. Same boat (78 CVX) same 2:1 gears on same motor 89 120hp big block Looper. Only diff is trim tabs mounted flush with the back of my boat. Mine's an 87 140hp. Still having trouble with blow out with my Bronze 2 blade 13 1/2 x 23 cupped. Ran 54 @ 6000 when it was a little cooler. Calculates 20% slip. Hub is OK. I marked it. Last week I got 46 @ 5000. 19% using 24 for pitch. Bent the leading edges out, no improvement. My 20 Raker computes (55 @ 6100 = 9.3%). Almost forgot we GPS'd the 15' Pipestone w/ 54 15hp Evinrude at 20.3 one aboard 17.8 mph two aboard. Boat wt about 222 or less.
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David quit messing around with that little Johnson and install the Tower Of Power on that sweet cvx and get 55mph right out of the box! Just kidding with ya, looks like your getting a lot of research out of it. I think that its cool that your trying some merc props on the Johnson.
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The bronze 2 blade is mine. Think I found the problem. Blades did not have side cup at the leading edge. It was blowing water out the side. Heated it and re-curved them. Will try on a cooler day. (More power). Measured the pitch with a formula on line. Calculates exactly 24" with the cup. Should run 2mph over rpm. Results later.
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Once I get the boat runnin again I was thinkin this prop might be fun to monkey around with. Solas 'Amita' 12 1/2 x 21 four blade aluminum. With my commercial discount I kin get one from Boats.net for a lil over $100 bucks.
But first I gotta put a motor back together ...
Stay tuned
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Steve, I'm surprised as you are that the Johnson is still on the CVX-16. Had a built in bias favoring Mercury's all my life. I'm not convinced that my backup 1988 115 HP Mercury would give me any more speed. On the National site, Gary (Volvo 80) runs 53.x on his CVS-16 with a 115 HP Merc that I believe is the old 140 HP and that is with his motor raised with a Laser II 22". I have one or two holes to go up and am currently running 54-55 MPH.
If changing motors were easy, I probably would have switched by now.
We'll see how the Johnson runs. The two motors, Johnson and Mercury, talk back and forth to each other in the garage. The Johnson does not want to be taken out of the lineup.
When I switch, the props for the Mercury will be a Laser II 22", and two bronze 2-blade props, a 21" pitch and a 22" pitch.
We miss you Steve. Come join us for one of the river runs.
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This should have been mentioned before. One reason why the OMC Rakers lose grip and cavitate is because they do not have a diffuser ring on the end of the exhaust hub. This flare is standard fare on most props, either as a gentle flare, a definite flare, or a separate diffuser ring. The diffuser ring is to help the prop lock up and get the boat on plane by preventing exhaust gas from getting to the blades of the prop, causing excessive slip or cavitation. It also aids in reducing exhaust back pressure.
Why it is omitted on the Rakers is anyone's guess.
See attached photos of a Raker, Ballistic, Lightspeed, and a Mercury Quicksilver.
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Diffusers are for wussies ...
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Hub is not OK. Rotated 190* from my mark. It may slip only when I take off(Blowout to 5000) Curved the blades in about another 1/8". At 5000 I'm running 46. 19% using 24 on the Prop Calculator. As I remember when we tested it on the 135 in 1971 It ran 52 at 5000. That's 15%, but have done a lot of changing since.
23 no cup on the 1.78 Merc gears.
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Was surfing e-bay (dangerous habit) and came across a new still-in-the-box OMC 2-blade bronze prop (seller states it was in a box stamped 1972). Prop is 13 3/4 x 21 with cupped blades. Asked my lovely wife if it was okay, and she said yes. This is my last prop. Will post better pictures when I get it.
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" This is my last prop "
Ya right Dave !
... LOL
Are you thinking about adding more pitch ?
MAN ... Summer's a LONNNNNGGGGG way off ....
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I'm thinking 21" pitch may be okay. The blades are 13 3/4 (some OMC are 12 3/4) and the blades cupped, which should add 1" of pitch. RPM's on the Johnson's are okay to 5,700 RPM. But it will be interesting to try it. Had good luck with Mercury 2-blade bronze props, but no experience with OMC.
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They have a smooth, low steering torque feel ... Hope it works out.
Joy must just "Shake her head" ... LOL
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You guy's always beat me to these prop deals. There's a 21" if I remember right on CL either MN or NE. $100 I think. I need a QS 24" two blade. Looking for more specs on the Quicksilver prop, Dave. I had the 21 AL on, posted here, I think 52 at 5900 or more. I just moved the trim tabs up 1 1/8" just before storage and filled the gaps. They were trimmed down 1/8" below the hull. That should correct my slip problem. I drove in 4 1/4" screws into the outside of the hub on the 23 bronze. Still blows out from slip on the take off but seems ok at top end.
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All right Dave, we basically have the same boat and motor, I'm running a 19" Michigan Apollo Prop, getting 48 to 49, would like to get over the 50 MPH range should I ever make it to one of the meets. What would you recommend for my boat, Christmas is just around the corner and my wife asked me what I wanted!!!
Joe
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If I had to pick one prop for my boat, it would be a 22" pitch OMC Raker. The Rakers seem to bring out the best in the Johnsons. If you need more RPM's, try the Raker 20" pitch.
Here is my thread from the national Glastron site where I try various props.
http://www.classicglastron.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=8603 (http://www.classicglastron.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=8603)
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Joe, found some good deals you can call on to see if they are stainless or Aluminum.
This is the one I remembered:(19 ss)
http://brainerd.craigslist.org/boa/4055773035.html (http://brainerd.craigslist.org/boa/4055773035.html)
http://omaha.craigslist.org/boa/4121719656.html (http://omaha.craigslist.org/boa/4121719656.html)
I have 4 props now. Will sell you my Michigan like new 13 1/4 x 21 SS vented.
Performs like my 20 raker. Got to have $200. I'll show it to you if you're in Fremont.
Do you have family up this way? I saw your pic posted at Fremont State Lakes.
I work there in the summer.
This is Davids test on the 21":
OMC SST 12 3/4" x 21" ran 52.2 @5,500 RPM
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GCarlover,
I sure hope my '87 Johnson 140 posts better numbers than you were seeing. It's going on a '77 CVX - 16 that ran a best on 48.2 GPS @ 5300 on smooth water with 8 - 10 gal fuel and myself at 185 turning the original 12 3/4 x 21 SST that is pretty worn.
Previous owner of the 140 had it on a heavy 18' flat aluminum boat with tank in the rear, three batteries, trolling motor and the original 23 sst and had video of 60 on GPS.
I better be in there with a Raker 22 or I can try a tweaked 23 Raker from the prop shop on the river.
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If I had to pick one prop for my boat, it would be a 22" pitch OMC Raker
Mine'd be a 13 1/2 x 22 Lightspeed. My favorite 'all around' prop.
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I sure hope my '87 Johnson 140 posts better numbers than you were seeing. It's going on a '77 CVX - 16 that ran a best on 48.2 GPS @ 5300 on smooth water with 8 - 10 gal fuel and myself at 185 turning the original 12 3/4 x 21 SST that is pretty worn
.
I had a 140 Johnson on my CVX16 for many years with a 19" Stainless it would do 55 all day long, you should easily hit the mid to upper 50's with a 21". If I hadn't spent so much money for the 115, I would have a 140 on it again. Extremely happy with the 115, but I sometimes miss the 140...go figure...
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Doug, do you need a backup 22" Lightspeed prop? Mine is for sale on Craigslist Minneapolis.
https://post.craigslist.org/manage/4186740266
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Doug do you have a 4 blade? I did some posting on the Checkmate forum with Wired and Marlboro. They don't believe you can get near 1% slip with a 4 blade but yet posted this which is 1.2 %
19 pitch Solas 4 blade Titan with go 58 MPH in mine at 6200
If that's a 2:1 150 Merc it's right, but the 150 XRI is 1.87 which is 7.6%.
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Thanks guys but I gotta get a motor back together 'fore I start thinkin' bout new props ...
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Found the prop I want on Ebay for $!00 + 15 shipping, but need a hub. QS Merc 14 x 24 Hi Perf two blade bronze. I'm afraid the big diameter might pull down the RPM. There might be a 13" for about 150. My neighbor has a broken OMC prop he might give me. That's how I did it last time but we don't have a prop shop that I know of now. They can get expensive. The guy we had pressed it in for $5.00. I made a manual pump log splitter that might work but I think you need a funnel to press them in. Oh well, I'd probably get banned from the lake. We have a 40 speed limit but yet the Lake Board wants to raise the HP for V-6s but not for outboards. Most of those go over 50.
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Prop arrived today. Looks new yet 41 years old. Will sharpen the blades and polish in the next few weeks. May be a winner. Weighs 12 pounds.
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That is cool.......I am a fan of the two blades, this will be interesting.
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WOW ... It even has the convergence hub on it ... COOL !
Can't wait to see it shining like a new penny !
Being that this is your "last prop" ... (HA HA) I hope it works out ... LOL
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It even has the convergence hub on it
That is interesting. Cool Dave, oughta look killer once ya work yer mojo on it.
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Classic boat, classic motor, and classic prop. All time period correct.
The driver is ancient history.
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The legend of " The Prop Hunter" will live on Dave !
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/DavePropHunter2.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/DavePropHunter2.jpg.html)
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The OMC 2- blade bronze prop 13 3/4" x 21" took four hours to polish. There were the usual factory scratches and sharpening of the leading edges of the blades in spots and by the hub. The procedure to finish the prop is to use a paddle wheel and small disc fine sandpaper attached to a drill for the rough stuff, then wet or dry sandpaper sheets 320, 400, 600, 800, and then a buffer wheel to finish polish with Mothers Mag & Aluminum Polish.
The prop was shipped in a flimsy box with inadequate packing and has a small dent in the ring that fits inside the lower unit housing, out of sight. Could have been much worse. May get it fixed at work.
Even if it is not the fastest prop, would look neat on the boat and motor at showtime.
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Prop looks great Dave !
Would it be possible to shine up my windshield bars ?
Bars are aluminum with some deep scratches, but don't look quite as bad as in this picture.
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/76%20CV16%20blue/windshieldbarscratches_zpse4a2bc60.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/76%20CV16%20blue/windshieldbarscratches_zpse4a2bc60.jpg.html)
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I had some pieces that looked like that Gregg. I think they came from the factory with a coat of Lacquer on them. I sanded them down and got them all shiny then got a spray can of Testor's clear Lacquer at the hobby shop and gave them a couple cotes. so far it's holding.
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If your windshield braces are like the rubrail inserts, they are anodized aluminum. The anodized coating is a different color than the underlying aluminum. Sure, the aluminum can be sanded down and polished back or left with a satin finish from the fine sandpaper. If you do one area, sand down the entire area. I would use sanding paddle wheels such as in the picture below, then switch to wet or dry sandpaper sheets in 320, 400, 600 and then Mothers Alum and Meg if you want the polished look.
Happy to do it for you, it you choose.
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The trim around wind shield plexi has the satin/anodized look to it like the rub rail, the side bar looks like aluminum.
I could be wrong ...
That answered my next question Jerry ...
About how to keep the rear corner trim pieces from getting water stained.
Or at least make them easier to clean up ...
Take some doing to clean them up after every outing, water spots stick to them like glue !
(http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p286/Hyperacme/76%20CV16%20blue/trimaroundWSplexi_zpsd201451c.jpg) (http://s131.photobucket.com/user/Hyperacme/media/76%20CV16%20blue/trimaroundWSplexi_zpsd201451c.jpg.html)
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If you Lacquer them they should just wipe off.
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I'll give it a try Jerry ...
After looking at wind shield trim and bars, it looks like bar have something on them to keep the shine, there's no way bare aluminum would look that good after 30 plus years ...
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David, did you have a 22 Quciksilver bronze that needed a new hub? Does anyone know the price to re-hub? Best price for a new OMC hub I found was $46. With a press I think you need a funnel and certain pressing tools. Someone on a forum had a prop split when he had it pressed in.
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Had the Quicksilver 22" bronze 2-blade rehubbed at Propulsion in Hudson for about $50 to $60.
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The 2-blade bronze OMC prop was shipped from Kentucky in a USPS thin flat rate box with little padding and apparently the box was dropped, resulting in a dented hub ring. Todd at work used a punch to reshape it to its original configeration.
The stainless steel SRX prop was also damaged in shipment on one blade, and the seller, Steve Smith, professional prop and lower unit man, fixed it better than new so one could not tell which blade was damaged.
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I'm trying to make a deal on a QS 24 pitch bronze. The guy backed out on his posted price but does not say why. Found another but waiting for postage check. I think you can send these UPS for about $10. They want $58 to re-hub at Olathe, KS. Don't use your prop for towing. Mine looks OK but it slips on take off. The rubber might be hard when it gets old. Have you tried the SRX? Nice shine It looks like the cup is heavy. Need to shine my Michigan. I have 4 rouge sticks. Not sure which to use.
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SRX 23" beats the Raker 22" by 1.3 MPH. 55.2 MPH GPS. Very happy with its performance.
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SRX 23" beats the Raker 22" by 1.3 MPH. 55.2 MPH GPS. Very happy with its performance.
Refresh my memory, what were your revs?
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The Raker 22" recorded 53.9 MPH at 5,400 RPM, and the SRX 55.2 MPH at 5,550 RPM, both GPS.
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Okay David. You've got the prop(s) purty much figgered out. Now you need to raise that motor a hole or two. Then the SRX can really work it's magic.
Not to suggest doing it all day but you can safely rev a crossflow a lil higher than 5500.
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Doug, raising the motor one or two holes on the outboard motor mounts is one of the projects for next spring. Each hole is 3/4" higher and that means alot of the fat lower unit will now be above the water. I figure 1 MPH for each hole raised. Adequate water pressure does not seem to be a problem. Stay tuned. Will be a show down between 4 good props one after the other on secret Lake WBL.
I have had the Raker 20" to 5,700 RPM.
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Never had a water pressure problem using the holes on hand. Go for it!
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On my 150 Merc I just used the 3 bottom intake holes. Filled the rest.
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh181/50sflash/DSC01264Medium-1.jpg)
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Never had a water pressure problem using the holes on hand. Go for it!
[/quote I would agree....I have not had any cooling issues using the tallest mount available on the engine brackets with a 20 inch transom (some production boats have as much as 23 inch) I think that 2 blade will be real close to the SRX top speed........
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On my 150 Merc I just used the 3 bottom intake holes. Filled the rest.
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh181/50sflash/DSC01264Medium-1.jpg)
I forwarded this to the Save The Manatee club ...
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My cav plate's 'round 2" above the keel. No backset/jackplate. No overheat problems.
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Yo David. Once ya raise the motor a lil you really oughta try a Bobs 'True Tracker' on that thang. It allowed me to do away altogether with my steering torque tab. Picked up .9 mph right there.
It is purty, and I hope for the best, but I doubt the 2 blade'll outshine the SRX. Jmo.
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The cavitation plate is about even with the bottom of the boat now. Raising the outboard motor 2 holes will mean 1 1/2 inches above the bottom. Since I do not have a water pressure gauge, will have to monitor the water stream closely at first - especially with the motor at extreme trim and around corners. Does the Johnson have a over heating warning alarm?
The best looking prop is the 2-blade bronze, but if I had to pick the fastest to the slowest, it would be in this order. The order is based on my guess that the CVX-16 likes bow lift. The fastest prop needs to lift the bow and reduce the wetted area. The 2-blade bronze does not appear to have the best lifting ability. It was manufactored in 1972 and technology advanced in designing the SRX and Raker. But it has sharp blades and only two. Therefore, guess of the order from fastest to slowest is:
SRX 23", Raker 22", Bronze 21" 2-blade, and then the Lightspeed 22".
These are all good props, faster than the stainless steel SST II's, and the aluminums.
You know me. I am a show off. Will publish the results next spring after the testing all in one day at secret Lake WBL.
Fastest could be 57 MPH and the slowest 54 MPH.
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I think this was in the 55 + mode..........
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Great pic. How'd you keep your cap on? Chin strap? :D
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That picture was taken by Mrs. Retro at secret lake WBL with Mr. Retro's SRX 23" prop. Thank you.
The cap stays on as long as I do not lift my head or turn to the side. I always wear a white cap to see it in the water.
Picture of the pit crew - Don's shirt "Mercury Racing" ? with the Johnson in the background.
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OMC accessory catalog 1976.......Difference between 2&3 Blade props explained and the application chart with the bronze 2 blades
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After losing a few prized hats, You'll remember never to look up, or turn your head at speed ...
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Doug: Have never lost a cap yet - just set me back in the race while running with other boats - as it is retrieved. Our steel suppliers (West Central Steel, Suger Steel, and
McNeilus) give us caps.
Don, interesting article about OMC props. All the 21" props, aluminum, stainless steel, and bronze, are listed with same top speed range of 43 to 52 MPH.
There is also a 23" bronze 2-blade, part #384138 that I was not aware of
http://www.vintageboatparts.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=87&products_id=9883 (http://www.vintageboatparts.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=87&products_id=9883)
I have a 21" 2-blade bronze cupped, part #384141. It also comes uncupped as part #384140
We all know that 2-blade props are not great for getting out of the water because of less blade area, but once they get up to speed, they are fast.
I suspect that if I tried the 3 props OMC lists as all having the same top speed of 43 to 52 MPH, there would be differences between the alum, SST, and the bronze.
No, I am not going to buy the 23" 2-blade bronze prop.
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Great pic. How'd you keep your cap on? Chin strap? :D
I just wear mine backwards, like some one from the hood
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I think once you run the 21 2 blade you will be looking for a 23 LOL.................
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Don, are you trying to tempt me at my weakest point? "Get thee behind me ..." LOL.
There may be a better prop out there, but I have done a pretty good job at finding some fast OMC props. Two years ago, I knew nothing about Johnson outboards or OMC props since I was a true blue (black) Mercury guy. Had to learn about OMC props by buying them, testing them, keeping a few, selling a few, until I am at the point where unless someone says he has tried this prop and it is better than the ones I own, I am not going to buy another one. Have nine already - 6 for OMC and 3 for Mercury.
The 21" 2-blade bronze OMC should be within the proper RPM range, even if up to 5,700 RPM's for brief periods. If not, Mark's Prop Shop will change the pitch one degree for $30.
How about a prop testing session at secret Lake WBL next spring?
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I posted a six prop test from the 80's some time back and the fastest was from Mach performance......these were the wheels sold through Second Effort.......I am not saying you should get one but..............LOL Yes I am in for prop testing this spring.......
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Mach props were owned by Second Effort and each blade was welded on the hub rather than being cast as one piece. Believe Mach props went out of business.
Another route to take would be to take a SRX, Raker, or 2-blade bronze prop to a good prop men and tell him what you want improved and if they have had experience with that prop, they would know the modifications to make. I know a prop man from Blaine who maintains props for someone in Twin City Power Boat Association.
My SRX prop was prepared by Steve Smith, well known by the Scream and Fly people and who does work for Jaco Racing. Perhaps that will be the fastest prop. Steve thought it would be 1 MPH faster than the Raker, and it turned out to be 1.3 MPH.
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Found this interesting site by David Cracknell Milford MI. He is Stromzilla on Youtube.
He buys and sells Etecs yearly. Sold two 130 HO s for $7800 each.
http://www.premiumsyntheticmotoroil.com/ (http://www.premiumsyntheticmotoroil.com/)
Go to the http://www.etecownersgroup.com/ (http://www.etecownersgroup.com/) (Owners Message Board)
Replies by Heeman and pics of his boat: (He was running 150 lbs compression test and 93 octane gas)
So 64 mph with a 27 pitch is do-able. It looks like the motor might be raised a couple inches.
Quote:
I was going to hijack this thread to tell him about my 1983 Glastron/Carlson CVX 16 that I own for 9 years with a 115 Merc, turning a 27" Pitch Stock SS Merc Prop. 63-65MPH depending on sea conditions
My 1984; 115 MERC, was a straight 6 cyl. They nicknamed them "Tower of Power" due to the height of the motor. No question that the etec would outrun/less fuel and quieter, if set up right. Setting any outboard on that hual to the correct height and proped right just like any hull is critical. When I bought it new with the origional set up 52 MPH Max. After seting it up to the correct height on the transom and the right prop, I gained 12-13 mph. Had a blast with that little rig, but that was a long time ago!
This is the forum:
http://www.etecownersgroup.com/post/79-glastron-wetec-130-5441687?highlight=glastron+carlson&trail=30 (http://www.etecownersgroup.com/post/79-glastron-wetec-130-5441687?highlight=glastron+carlson&trail=30)
83 Carlson pictures:
http://www.etecownersgroup.com/post/79-glastron-wetec-130-5441687?pid=1272708965#post1272708965 (http://www.etecownersgroup.com/post/79-glastron-wetec-130-5441687?pid=1272708965#post1272708965)
http://www.etecownersgroup.com/post/79-glastron-wetec-130-5441687?highlight=glastron+carlson&trail=30 (http://www.etecownersgroup.com/post/79-glastron-wetec-130-5441687?highlight=glastron+carlson&trail=30)
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Started thinning the blades of the Raker 22". The secret is to take a broad area off the back of the blade so that there is a gradual tappering to the leading edge. Right now there is too much of a curl near the edge. The Raker right now is 1.3 MPH slower than the SRX. Lets see if we can narrow that gap.
Using a block vibrator sander starting with 220 grit sandpaper with water.
There are prop shops that do this ($75 and up) - Ron Hill, Steve Smith, DAH, but I can do it myself and learn from it. Will also test it against a factory stock Raker 22".
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The balancing device described on this post works well. Have a 3/4 shaft that fits tight in the OMC hub. Used 3/4 copper for the Merc(about 7/8) I had previously thinned the blades on the 23 bronze and were not the same thiackness. OK now. Also rebuilt the flange with solder and turned down by hand in the lathe. Have to offset the shaft because my Lathe is 12". This one was possibly slipping but decided not to re-hub. Will use super glue and epoxy in the holes in the hub. Turned down the bronze 24 to very little wall thickness to fit the OMC lower unit. Re-hubbed at Midwest propeller Olathe KS.
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Finished thinning the blades of the 22" Raker. A professional would have removed more metal from the back of the blade to make it thinner. I used caution to remove the metal uniformly from the back of the blades, trying to avoid ripples and dips. Blades appear fairly sharp. Next step is to test it against an original factory 22" Raker and compare MPH.
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I saw another interesting prop this morning and am inquiring about it.
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I saw another interesting prop this morning and am inquiring about it.
Wouldn't happen to be an SSTR would it David? 8)
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I saw another interesting prop this morning and am inquiring about it.
Wouldn't happen to be an SSTR would it David? 8)
No, that is Don's cleaver prop for a V-6 Evinrude.
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Dave, How do you know it is mine...........I do have a 22-23 pitch cleaver to fit a V4 though ;)
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Can he test it on your super secret "Lake X" Don ?
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Don, I was just guessing that it was yours, with the OMC ad accompanying it. Is it yours? I am thinking that a cleaver would not be a good prop for my CVX-16 since the cleaver does not give bow lift and the CVX-16 needs the bow lift to reduce the wet area of the hull. Does your cleaver have a rubber hub?
Still inquiring about the prop I'm thinking of buying. The owner said he was fishing today but would get back to me tomorrow. Ran it on Hydrostreams.
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I have the v6 Cleaver on there and I do have the v4 cleaver as well.....I use the cleavers on Tunnel Boats. Good guess
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I asked permission.
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Is that your new ones ?
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I liked the first SRX 23" pitch so much - 1.3 MPH faster than the Raker 22" - that I bought a 2nd SRX. Coming soon from Florida and said to be a 10 out of 10. Will get the usual polish job. May use this SRX for everyday use instead of a Raker. We will see. Will be testing props when the ice melts.
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Did you see all the props Jerry S has for sale ?
I'm guessing it Jerry, from the address ...
Propellers Stainless and Aluminum High Performance - $50 (Inver Grove Heights)
http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/dak/boa/4410055803.html (http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/dak/boa/4410055803.html)
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Yes it is Jerry, alot of old 2-blade bronze props, an SRX, Jerry said he had a new Raker, plus alot of Mercury racing props. I imagine Jerry inherited alot of the props from his boat racing father, so you might have 40 or more years of props, and from both Mercury and Johnson.
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After about 6 hours of work getting the satin finish scratches out, here is the end product:
Now we need warmer weather to melt the ice and so that we can test 5 props
SRX 23 purchased new
SRX 23 purchased used, the one I just finished
Raker 22 factory original
Raker 22 with thinned blades
OMC 2-blade bronze purchased new
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Virtual Tour – Part 6: Propellers
http://www.mercuryracing.com/blog/virtual-tour-part-6-propellers/#more-7147 (http://www.mercuryracing.com/blog/virtual-tour-part-6-propellers/#more-7147)
Virtual Tour – Part 7: Cleaver Revolution
http://www.mercuryracing.com/blog/virtual-tour-part-7-cleaver-revolution/ (http://www.mercuryracing.com/blog/virtual-tour-part-7-cleaver-revolution/)
http://youtu.be/nyh_-11S988 (http://youtu.be/nyh_-11S988)
http://youtu.be/OJJsOY3mnSI (http://youtu.be/OJJsOY3mnSI)
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Thanks Gregg. Wish I had the resources that Mercury Racing has for casting, finishing, and testing props. Note that the 2-blade bronze was the racers choice in the 60's and 70's, but the need for better balance, acceleration, and handling necessitated the conversion to stainless steel props with more blades.
Steve Smith of SDS in Kentucky sold me the SRX last fall. Listening to him talk about the various areas of props and each area's function makes your head swim. He does work for Jaco Racing. Has alot of templates for props to improve their performance. His prop came to me with a dent in one blade because the shipping box was dropped. Sent it back to Steve who fixed it so perfectly that you can not detect the former damaged area.
http://www.sdspropshop.com/Prop_Work/Prop_Work.html (http://www.sdspropshop.com/Prop_Work/Prop_Work.html)
It will be interesting to test Steve's SRX with the one I just purchased. I think Steve's will be faster because he thinned the blades and generally improved it over the OMC factory issued prop.
To have the blades thinned, Ron Hill was recommended - their specialty.
I just like polishing and testing props for midrange speed boats. Know there is alot of theory and finishing techniques to be learned, but I enjoy props at this level.
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Did you see in one part of the video, Mercury "blacked out" the edge of a prop ...
Must have been a secret.
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There must be a tool to make the leading edge of the prop precisely razor sharp, something like a miter tool that grips the prop edge as the cutter moves forward.
In talking to Dave Osborn (?) prop man at Performance Marine who maintains the props for someone in the Twin City Power Boat Assoc., he also has some secrets.
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i just sent the payment for this one ;D
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Suweet! Looks just like my Lightspeed, sans vents. Good choice Joe.
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Just needs a little touch up on the edges. You know it works Joe as you tried my 20" pitch Raker on your GT-150 at last summer's Glastron meet and it went 2 MPH faster than your previous prop - 49 MPH.
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Just needs a little touch up on the edges. You know it works Joe as you tried my 20" pitch Raker on your GT-150 at last summer's Glastron meet and it went 2 MPH faster than your previous prop - 49 MPH.
I expect with more time, and the adjustments I made to the trim tab I will break 50
When I borrowed your prop it Redwing, I had only been running with the power trim on that for a few hours.
In the weeks that followed I got a really good feel for it.
and I got it for a good price :)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2
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Yup. Cain't beat trim. Now ya gotta raise that motor a hole mebbe.
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Yup. Cain't beat trim. Now ya gotta raise that motor a hole mebbe.
I think it's up 1 now, not sure the steering cable can Handel more :/
And I don't See me throwing down for hydraulic.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2
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Even with my motor almost all the way up and Hyd. steering my CV does NOT like to go over 53 mph !
It will do it ... BUT it's a hand full !
I believe Mark S has had his GT up there ( his tag lists 54 mph on CGOA ).
There is a fix for the problem ....
It's buy a CVX16 !
... LOL
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I'll be happy being able to say I have a 50mph boat without lying. :)
Prop will be here tomorrow. I'm hoping to have a chance to get out Sunday and try it out.
Oh Dave... Sorry for hijacking yer thread !
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2
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No problem. Hope you reach 50 MPH.
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TBT I rarely go over 52mph now days, I like to stay on this side of sanity. Somewhere around 53-54 is where it gets crazy!
Prop Test Results to Date;
Mission is to get WOT at 55-5600, with max SAFE speed. (Looking for 55!)
Starting point/baseline - 1st Prop - OMC brand 12 3/4 X 21P ALUM - WOT 5400 @ 54MPH - Note: gets a little hairy over 53mph, nature of the hull design as I am told.
2nd Prop - OMC SST 12 3/4 X 21P Stainless (teflon coated) - *WOT 5200 @ 52MPH - Note: more left on the table in the speed, *chine walk gets too severe to continue. Porpoising at lower speeds if trimmed above 1/4. Probably going to be the fastest/best all around, if the set-up can be refined to control the boat at top speed.
3rd Prop - OMC Raker 13 3/4 X 22P Stainless - WOT 5100 @ 50MPH - Note: Too much pitch & bow lift, didn't like much if any trim, porpoise and chine walk prevalent, much better suited to CVX style hulls with pad.
4th Prop - OMC SST II 13 3/4 X 19P - *WOT 5800 (pulled back, was still winding up!) at 48MPH - Note: not enough pitch, might be a good prop for heavy loads or pulling barges.
5th Prop - Power Tech PT03(?) 13 1/5 X 19 w/custom cupping and pitch added - WOT 5200 @ 48MPH - Note: Stern lift created by this prop gives a whole new "feel" to the boat, thought we had it here. RPM and MPH just not where they need to be.
Back to props 1 and 2, with a Solas Amita 3 13 X 19P as a back-up/spare/emergency. Will probably try raising the motor up another hole as suggested, and maybe add a Bob's True Tracker to help with stability. All numbers posted from recollection, so please forgive me if they're not exactly as stated earlier.
Special thanks to David P. (CGOAMN), & Tim at Performance Props Inc - Soddy Daisy, TN.
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Mark, props now to try on your GT-150 are an OMC cleaver, an OMC 2-blade bronze, or possibly a Ballistic 21".
Soon I will be trying 5 props - 2 - 22" Rakers, 2 - 23" SRXs, and the 21" 2-blade bronze.
Do not expect the 2-blade bronze to be as fast as the other props, as it does not have the rake to lift the bow needed to go fast on the CVX hull.