Author Topic: V175 work  (Read 106468 times)

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Offline dorelse

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #20 on: April 05, 2011, 09:07:53 PM »
I had to order some specific bolts from the dealer...they just weren't readily available.  Good news is they were cheap, so any 'mark up' you'll likely eat up in gas running around.

Just my experience on my rebuild.
1990 Sierra 1700

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #21 on: April 10, 2011, 09:20:13 PM »
Thanks for the advice Doran.

Made some headway over the last few days. Have all or most of fittings, pulled stuff off the transom to reseal and a lot of little things that keep distractinng me! Like that other boat just a few feet away.

Today I was overjoyed to find that I think I finally have the throttle/reverse cables set up so they work. Got out the book I bought and read about where the bucket should be in neutral and reverse, so I'm a bit relieved. I still may take it in to have it tweaked.

Question for Red, since you had GLM's before. I plumbed things so that I thought the routing would be cleaner but that doesnt mean its right. I know yours newer and totally different BUT did you plumb in on top at the front and out on the bottom rear? That is how I did it but after looking at it today, I see that this set up is going to make it difficult to pull one spark plug on each side. I am thinking about plugging that bottom port now and using the other one in the top.

I honestly do not know the direction of flow on this thing. It appears that the two lines that used to go to the front of the manifolds are downstream of the thermostat and am still scratching my head as to how water gets to the block. The only way I can see is by a hose that runs to the jet intermediate housing mounted on the outside of the transom. This used to be "tee'd" into a line that ran between the risers. There is no intake there other then the jet bowl. Seems odd they would be trying to pull water into the motor in that area with all that turbulence??
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline OleRed

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #22 on: April 11, 2011, 12:20:54 AM »
Hope this helps you,  but I'm not sure how much pressure the bowl from a jet drive is producing, a Lot more than an impeller pump though, thats why you see most jet jumps have a restrictor valve in the supply line, it can be restricted to run the temp you want to run your motor.  There are several different types of thermostat housings, and some of the jets don't need a circulation pump at all, like this 455 pic ?  I'm no authority on the jet stuff, but I do know that you can runn either of these set-up with a jet pump, but I think you need to regulate the pressure, with the restrictor valves in the supp;y line, or your motor may not warm up.  The picture I'm including with the certer rise GLM manifolds, Barbs motor, always run's about 170 degree's, except at wide open throttle, then it drops to about 160.  I believe the Merctuiser impeller pumps about 26 to 28 pounds pressure at wot, maybe a little more,  a jet will produce a lot more.
1980 23ft Scimitar

Offline OleRed

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #23 on: April 11, 2011, 12:22:14 AM »
more pic's
1980 23ft Scimitar

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #24 on: April 11, 2011, 06:58:52 PM »
Much plumbing! How did you figure that all out. Those shown are quite different especially the thermostat housing and I do have a fairly normal looking water pump on the front of the engine.

At least with an I/O you can run it in you driveway and maybe pull hoses but I dont see how I can. Maybe one of those "fake a lakes" made for inboard ski boats but I dont know if that would seal up very well.

Again, with mine, if that hose from the intermediate jet housing is an "IN" line, then where is the out? Out the exhaust is all that is left but I do not know if there is a passage within the riser that would allow that. I've been poking around in there with a wire to try to see what is connected to what.
I am concerned too that I could put the riser gasket on 90 degrees out. It could fit wither way but restrict something I may not want to then I'd be chasing my tail trying to figure out if its overheating because I installed that wrong or plumbed it wrong. It would be nice if I knew something was "right" from the start.


Guess I'll just have to pick a way and try it. Run it and see what gets hot.
More questions...

Did you use gasket cement on your GLM's? I mentioned it to Dennis Moore and he said you dont have to but I am not real comfortable not using some, at least on the risers.
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #25 on: April 11, 2011, 07:17:39 PM »
Old pic of line from jet housing to tee and risers.
So I am going to proceed with it as closely as original. If that is the feed, the in through the risers and then up to 2 lines (and in and out?) on the front of the manifolds. Another thing I find out is that those lines appear to be above the thermostat. I dont remember if they are normally open or closed but I thought the idea was, in a car, keep the coolant in the engine until it warms to whatever...190 then open. If this is the case here and both the lines are about the t stat and its closed, I dont see how water can get into the block.
Sure looks like the T stat is sitting right down on the intake, just like a vehicle. Guess I should pull that apart look at it and might as well put a new stat in too.
When taking some stuff off, I am worried I'll encounter another ODD gasket that cant be bought. Guess I could just use "form a gasket"
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline OleRed

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2011, 12:17:20 AM »
ok ... you can not use the old thermostat housing you have with the new manifolds you got, here's why, the old OMC tube style manifolds, that you are throwing away, flow different than the new one's you bought from Dennis, and no, you don't need any gasket sealer to install them.  The old set you removed got the water supply from the "T" into the side of the riser, the water flowed through the manifold log to the end cap on the front of the manifold, where there are two ports, one of those ports direct water into the thermostat housing where the water is devided, a small rectangle passage goes past the thermostat, back down into the other port on front of the manifold and right back through the manifold log, then on out the exhaust.  Where the water supply is devided at the thermostat housing, some through the little rectangle by-pass, the rest holds supply to the motor for cooling, and after the thermostat opens, that warm water is discharged into the manifold logs through the other port on the end cap .. so, the thermostat housing you have there only has one discharge port for each manifold, the new mainfolds you have require two discharge ports for each manifold.

You need to toss the old thermostat housing in the same pile with the old manifolds, get the one required for the new manifolds, and make you an adaptor to join the 1/2" supply line from the pump bowl to the 1 1/4" supply port on the new thermostat housing, and I would suggest putting a "gate valve" as a restrictor, in the 1/2" line also, you may need to restrict the pressure from the pump with it,  as I said before, there may be too much pressure for the thermostat to open properly at wot.  all this may or may not be right ya know, my brain is old, forgetful, and beginnin to hurt.
1980 23ft Scimitar

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2011, 08:18:48 AM »
Oh man this is giving me a headache!
OK so I need a new t stat housing. When looking for one, how many ports will I need? One in, four out? That still leaves the risers unplumbed if I am thinking right and I probably am not.
6 out? Must be something here tied in a loop.
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline OleRed

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2011, 09:53:15 AM »
here's a link to one on ebay, you might find one cheaper used, but I'd suggest buying a new one to be sure the restrictor balls and springs seal properly,  they keep the constant water supply to the risers from backing up into the the thermostat discharge passage.  Once again,  get an opinion on the set-up from a qualified marine mechanic,  I'm not,  but my suggestions may get you closer to a solution, Once again, get an opinion from someone familiar with the pressure from the jet drive, and how it affects the thermostat operation.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/THERMOSTAT-HOUSING-KIT-MERCRUISER-1983-NEWER-V6-V8-/310137061656?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item48359c0118

1980 23ft Scimitar

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #29 on: April 12, 2011, 10:24:07 AM »
I think I'm getting an ulcer. Guess I'll talk to someone before buying one. Hope I dont have to drag the boat into them but might have to.

Thanks for getting me going in this direction now rather then later.
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline Hotwired

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #30 on: April 12, 2011, 12:46:14 PM »
I ordered this one and the associated cap for my 305 and it provides the 6 outlets.  Marine parts dot com has a good selection of Sierra and OEM Mercruiser.  I bought the Sierra version.  I am not sure what the upper thermostat housing part number is but Marine Parts order department was able to get me the correct upper housing which has the other 2 of the 6 outlets on it

http://www.marineparts.com/p-1011-mercruiser-lower-thermostat-housing.aspx
.. it is what it is ... and that is how it should be!
Miss Mayberry - 1964 Saberflite
The Ship - 1979 CV-27
Canon Ball Eyes - 1976 CV-16ssV8
Da ProJect Bote - 1977 CV-23
It Is What It Is...... CVX20

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #31 on: April 12, 2011, 02:06:28 PM »
Chris

Why did you have to do this?

Its looking more and more like I may have to take it in. I am over my tiny budget already this spring. I may go by a place and see if I can get some "free" info out of a mechanic to at least find out for sure if I need to change that housing and if so, get one, then bring it in if I an not get the plumbing figured out. I trust the info I get here, but like Red said, talk with a Marine mechanic.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2011, 02:20:08 PM by Rosscoe »
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline Hotwired

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #32 on: April 12, 2011, 02:49:51 PM »
That is the original configuration on the 898's in my CV-27.  Both thermostat housings on the engines were cracked and rusted to pieces.



.. it is what it is ... and that is how it should be!
Miss Mayberry - 1964 Saberflite
The Ship - 1979 CV-27
Canon Ball Eyes - 1976 CV-16ssV8
Da ProJect Bote - 1977 CV-23
It Is What It Is...... CVX20

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #33 on: April 12, 2011, 02:52:10 PM »
The one component thats missing on yours to mine is the supply line coming from the jet housing.
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline OleRed

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #34 on: April 12, 2011, 03:08:29 PM »
Both thermostat housings on the engines were cracked and rusted to pieces.
                    Salt Worms ... I hate it when that happens !
that type of thermostat housing you have Chris is for the early style manifolds, like yours,  Ross has the newer style with center risers, only need two hose's to each one.
1980 23ft Scimitar

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #35 on: April 12, 2011, 08:48:32 PM »
Salt worms? Yuck

OK so I stopped and talked to a Marine mechanic after work. Sam at Sams Marine. This is the guy that worked on Scotts (Scotty007) CV-19 and he was petty familiar with what I had and explained to me the flow.
The line from the jet is the supply of course, the it fed the risers which were tied together. The water proceeded up through one port in the manifolds to the front, exited and goes to the t stat housing. Apparently water by passes the t stat and gets into the block, then when thats warm, the stat opens and the water comes back out the other two points on the t stat housing and goes back to the manifolds back through another seperate port and out the exhaust.
So he said I can get by with my old housing by teeing the supply line and tieing those together but two bad things about that. There is no neat way of doing that and I have to run a hose all the way from the transom to the stat housing.
Then the other two lines out of the t stat housing go to the manifolds, water goes thru up into the risers and out the exhaust. Seems too simple now. With this scenario, I now have to replug the openings I had plumbed on the top of the manifolds and the risers since they are not needed.
Also another wrong idea I had about running it only in a lake/river. Jets are not as fussy as an impeller in an outboard or outdrive, so I only have to be concerned about the motor.
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #36 on: April 12, 2011, 09:00:51 PM »
So I plan on installing a fitting in the supply line that I can hook a garden hose up to and rig it like he said AT LEAST so I can run it. Eventually I will change the housing because there really isnt a very clean way to tee 3 hoses together and have it not in the way of carb linkage, alternator belts and pulleys. I will tie wrap it back in several places because something rubbing on it would wear thru needless to say. Need to leave enough of a radius as to avoid kinks too. I am still not totally clear how the new housing eliminates the "tee" but I'll cross that bridge when I get to it and I may have Sam do it. I dont know though...105.00/ hour. I work for a lot less but I plan on bringing it to him to have him tweak the cable adjustments once I know the motor is not an anchor.
I have a machinest at work making me some 1/4" spacers to make the 5" bolts work like the 4 1/2's I need. He said he could cut the bolts but he is doing this on company time so whatever is easiest... then I should be able to mount them up this weekend.

Red, I'll post a pic later of the gasket/ riser and see what you say about the orientation of that. I am sure one way makes more sense then the other, but not to me right now. Knowing the direction of flow now will help me understand better.
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #37 on: April 16, 2011, 07:41:40 PM »
Hillbilly hoist.
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline Rosscoe

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #38 on: April 16, 2011, 07:47:17 PM »
Got my exhaust tips, bildge pump bulkhead fitting and some other stuff reinstalled today now that I picked up some 4200. I made a slight modification to the stock exhaust set up. Whatda think?
Ross
61 Surflite 1964 90HP Johnson project
67 V163 Bayflite Super Sport  1989 100HP Merc
67 V164 Bayflite 120HP
67 V174 Crestflite Rat Rod
71 V175 Crestflite 350ci -Jet
73 GT 160
84 CVX 17  83 115 Merc
88 CVX-23 350 Mag

Offline Hyperacme

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Re: V175 work
« Reply #39 on: April 16, 2011, 07:50:08 PM »
.... LOL
Should sound BAD Ross ...
....LOL