Author Topic: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130  (Read 651 times)

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Offline NBD925

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1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« on: August 29, 2020, 03:12:18 PM »
Hello, I have a 1972 Glastron Bayflite V16 with the Volvo AQ130 engine. I get a top speed of 25 MPH and RPM of 3950. This seems very low to me. I thought this boat would go at least 30MPH if not a little faster. I have tried a lower pitch prop (14x16) and got 26 MPH (With GPS) at 4500 RPM

Is this all the faster this boat is? Iím ok with it going slower but just thought maybe our boat was not at its full potential.

Boat does have some scum on the bottom but not a terrible amount.

Here are some current boat specs:

Prop: 14x19
RPM: 3950
Speed: 25 MPH (Read on GPS)
Elevation: 4000 feet

Or

Prop: 14x16
RPM: 4500
Speed: 26 MPH (Read on GPS)
Elevation: 4000
« Last Edit: August 30, 2020, 11:12:29 AM by NBD925 »

Offline Hyperacme

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V16 AQ130
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2020, 07:51:28 PM »
Not sure about the I/O Glastron's .. but outboards had rubber stoppers in holes to drain under floor.
Check for plugs or any blockage and tilt boat up as far as it will go to see if water is trapped.

Have you checked compression / timing / is carb clean and adjusted / plugs / wires / etc. ?
Motor spec's & prop suggestions don't start until 1976 in Glastron P.I.G.'s

Volvo Penta still has owners manuals for motor & drives on there web site ..
If you can't find them .. I could email them to you. PM me your address.

The 1973 V174 is about same weight and size as your and lists a 14 X 19 prop.
Looks like 5100 RPM's is MAX.
Gregg
'76 CV16

Offline Hyperacme

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V16 AQ130
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2020, 07:54:19 PM »
Your rubber plugs could be where red circles are ..
Gregg
'76 CV16

Offline NBD925

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2020, 10:21:33 PM »
I will check the drains tomorrow but it has been a consistent problem for the last 20 or more years. 

Here is what we have done to try to fix the problem. Also the new results.  Still very low but a slight improvement.

Checked Compression:
Cylinder 1:  147
Cylinder 2:  147
Cylinder 3:  148
Cylinder 4:  148

Installed New Water Pump Impeller
Installed New Water Pump Seals and O-ring for between seals (oil and water slinger)
Installed new Water Pump Rubber Shaft Engagement
Installed new water pump Shaft 822994-2
Installed New Fuel Pump 273132
Installed new Bosch Plugs W5B
Gapped Spark Plugs to .30
Adjusted Carb Linkage (Throttle Plates weíre not fully opening) Throttle forks were not properly set.
Adjusted Timing to 12 degrees and checked advance at 28 degrees
Adjusted trim bolt to raise motor
Adjusted steering trim tab

New results:
Engine: AQ130
Hour Meter: 910
Prop: Michigan Wheel SMC-549 14x19
4150 - 4200 RPM
Speed 28- 29 MPH checked with GPS
Elevation: 4000 feet
Slight scum on bottom of boat

1/4 tank of fuel as a weight reference

Thank you for the kind offer of the information.  That picture of the boat on the top is my boat.  Gold and Sand V164 with AQ130  I do have the original books for this boat.  I noticed the Speed listed as 35-37

I have a ways to go.  I just canít figure out what else to do? 


« Last Edit: August 29, 2020, 10:25:12 PM by NBD925 »

Offline NBD925

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2020, 01:04:15 PM »
I have checked the rubber stoppers and there is no water in the hull.  I didnít think there would be only because this has been a problem for over 20 years.  I donít think this boat has ever hit 30 MPH

Does anyone have any ideas what to check or what could be going on here?  It seems like Iím missing 600-800 RPM with this 14x19 prop combination.  I could always prop down to the 14x16 but I think that would be masking the Real problem.

Offline Hyperacme

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2020, 04:56:41 PM »
Maybe boat's tested in the Glastron P.I.G.'s had optional tilt & trim ?
I only have a basic knowledge of I/O's and even less about Volvo I/O's.

Glastron brochures and P.I.G.'s can be found here ..
 https://www.glastron.com/us/catalogs-and-product-information

Glastron owners manuals are here ..
https://www.glastron.com/uploads/2017/3/Glastron-Manual-70s-IO.pdf

Volvo Penta manuals ..
https://www.volvopenta.com/marineleisure/en-en/for-owners/your-engine/manuals---handbooks.html
Gregg
'76 CV16

Offline NBD925

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2020, 10:50:35 PM »
Thanks for all the info Gregg.  That will be very helpful!  I hope someone can chime in with an idea of what to check or how to get more Speed.  Iím kind of stumped right now.  Iím not sure what else I can do.  I might get a brush and try to really clean the Hull.  It can only help I guess.  There has to be something thatís not quite right here.

Offline Jason

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2020, 10:29:31 AM »
If you have a lot of scum on the bottom it can slow you down. Muriatic acid will clean that off nicely but itís nasty stuff you donít want to get on you. Can buy at any local hardware store. Spray it on, let it soak, then pressure wash.
Jason S.
1974 Glastron Carlson CV16SS 140 I/O
1986 Glastron Carlson CV23 260 I/O

Offline Plugcheck

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2020, 11:11:23 AM »
I would clean the hull and wax to protect it.  I've used Star Brite, easy on, easy off and it works well.  Even used toilet bowl cleaner which does a good job. I think it works because it has muratic acid in it.  Wear gloves and eye protection.  Not making 30 mph does seem odd, maybe try a smaller wheel in the same pitch? I've heard that dynos exist to check HP at the prop, but I've never had a boat tested.  Could the exhaust be clogged up? 
Michael
1979 CVZ-18 388 CI Vortec Mouse
1980 CVX-16SS 140 Mercruiser
1979 CVX-16 Johnson 175
2002 Bennington 2275CC 90 Mercury
1985 Intimidator project
1989 Lowe 200 Redneck fishin Toon
2001 Godfrey Sweetwater pontoon 115 Rude

Offline Hyperacme

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #9 on: August 31, 2020, 11:24:53 AM »
Just read your post on CGOA forum ..   http://www.classicglastron.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=11688

You list "Elevation: 4000 feet" .. Maybe carb jetting ?
I know Merc Alpha's have different ratio's for different HP motors, not sure if 270 Volvo's do also.
Maybe you got wrong ratio from factory.

Had a cruiser that I slipped, by end of summer it lost a few MPH from scum, maybe 2 to 3 MPH.
But it was like grass was growing on bottom .. Algae
Gregg
'76 CV16

Offline NBD925

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #10 on: August 31, 2020, 08:53:01 PM »
Update so far.  I donít have any water in my hull that I can see.  Everything is dry.   Iím leaning toward the main jet not being properly sized for my elevation on the dual Solex PA44 carbs.

I decided to do a test tonight.  I ran the boat full speed for 1-2 miles.  While running, I took down the standard measurements, 4250 RPM @ 29 MPH.  I think the slight increase in RPM From 4200 is due to the cooler air temps.  Previous air temps were 85-90 and tonight it is a colder 56 degrees.  Toward the end of my 2 mile sprint at full speed I shut off the key and cut the throttle.  I was hoping this would freeze the Spark plugs in there current burn state.  I pulled each plug from front to back and looked them over.  They are almost brand new but they were black with carbon. Every one and the rear most plug was slightly worse. They were Not light tan like you would want to see.  Next, I read the plugs after extended idling and they looked much better although I think I could go slightly leaner on the idle mixture screw too. 

The high speed test seems to show Iím running Rich.  This would make sense why this boat has never gone above 30 MPH in the 40 plus years we have owned it.  At least itís a possibility.
 
Does anyone know if there is a rule of thumb for jetting solex carbs.  I saw only one post on a different forum with someone saying, go one jet size down per 1000 feet. Is this right?  Does anyone know what main jet I should have? Iím at 4000 feet so 3-4 sizes Down from stock?

I did not make note of the main jet size stamp when I rebuilt the carbs last year. Iíll have to check that out. 

Can anyone shed light on this subject? 


Offline Hyperacme

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2020, 11:25:42 PM »
Not much info ...

http://www.volvopentastore.com/Carburetor/dm/cart_id.710988394--session_id.430340872--store_id.366--view_id.771668

Maybe find a Volvo motor forum on some site like "Iboat"

I have no clue what our elevation is .. 4000 feet sound high .. 
Gregg
'76 CV16

Offline NBD925

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #12 on: August 31, 2020, 11:54:22 PM »
I may have written the Carb model incorrectly.  They are dual 44PA1 carbs. I looked up some jets and I think The stock main jet is #155.  Iíll check my main jet size tomorrow.  Would I go down to a 150

If you go down one jet size per 1000 feet (Sea Level =0) would that be a jet size #151.  155-4=151.  150 would be the closest jet size to that but am I doing that right?

Offline Hyperacme

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2020, 12:28:49 AM »
I have no idea .. but lean it down sounds right .. Maybe ?
Can you even get different jets ?
Gregg
'76 CV16

Offline Hyperacme

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2020, 11:15:58 AM »
Maybe try a Volvo Penta dealer in Colorado or Montana for high altitude jetting info ?
Gregg
'76 CV16

Offline Plugcheck

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2020, 11:20:40 AM »
I would think someone else running that drivetrain might be able to report their jetting.   Definitely a rich condition, but might be caused by something else, fuel level in bowl too high is one.  Choke malfunction?  Air correction off?  Dirty air filter?  4000' elevation will have an effect if jetted at sea level.  Bouncing around in a boat can affect fuel control as well.
Michael
1979 CVZ-18 388 CI Vortec Mouse
1980 CVX-16SS 140 Mercruiser
1979 CVX-16 Johnson 175
2002 Bennington 2275CC 90 Mercury
1985 Intimidator project
1989 Lowe 200 Redneck fishin Toon
2001 Godfrey Sweetwater pontoon 115 Rude

Offline NBD925

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2020, 10:46:20 PM »
Plugcheck: all good thoughts and I e tried to check each one of those off the list.  These Solex 44PA1 carbs donít have allot of those features.  No air correctors, no chokes, no air filters (only Metal Spark Arrestors) I adjusted the floats last year I think the floats are good to go. 

Update:  My Dual Solex 44PA1 On the AQ130 have 145 Main Jets installed.  I just checked tonight.  Does anyone know what size main jets came stock in the AQ130 package?  I thought I read somewhere it was 155 main jets. 

Can anyone confirm? 

Offline aquamaniac

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2020, 11:14:01 PM »
It seems like you should be going faster for the RPMs you're getting. Have you tried adjusting the tilt pin for more trim? The Volvo doesn't have power trim but I believe it does have a tilt pin that can be placed through one of multiple holes to adjust trim angle.

Offline NBD925

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #18 on: September 03, 2020, 09:48:00 PM »
I was able to order a set of original Solex 142.5 Main jets off eBay. I will be giving those a try to see if I can get the spark plugs that perfect tan color at high speed.

As I was looking and reading I found that most Solex jets are the same and that they are almost the same as Weber Keihin, Mikuni and a few other common carbs. At least they have the same thread pitch. It got me thinking. I had a Weber carb jet kit for my Jeep J-10. I put a Weber 38 on that truck and had some left over jets. 140ís, 150ís, 155ís and a set of 160 main jets in the kit. I did some experimenting swapping them into the Solex 44PA1 for testing.

Remember I am at 4000 feet elevation:

140 slowed the boat from 4200 RPM to 3950 RPM
150 Was at 4150 RPM
155 Was at 4000 RPM

I decided the 142.5 jets, when they arrive will be worth trying out because they would only be slightly leaner than the stock 145ís and that is exactly what I need. It may not help much but Iím going to try.

eBay has a bunch of off brand Solex jets that should work if you want to experiment. I measured the jets at 9mm length, 8mm head width, and a Metric 5mm x .75mm thread pitch.

Another thing tested, I had moved the trim bolt on the 270 outdrive to the third rear most hole for trim. There are only 3 holes for trim adjustment. The 4th hole is for the motor bracket that holds the motor in the locked up position for trailering, I guess. The 4th hole is smaller in diameter and will not accept the larger trim bolt. I was surprised there is not more trim adjustment on this 270.

I lost 1 MPH from 29 to 28 but that was because I had a full gas tank of gas Today.  The RPMs remain the same at 4200.

Dwell angle was tested and it is at a perfect 63 degrees. Another thing off the list.

I purchased the Pertronix 2842 Electronic Ignition and the Flame-Thrower 40511 Flame Thrower Coil Package in Amazon. I will update on what that gets me in an increase in RPM.

Iím still not satisfied with the turn out. 4200 and 29 MPH on 1/4 tank is not what this boat should do. Itís not right. It should be faster.

Things on the list to do:

Clean the bottom of the boat
Weigh the boat
New high speed Aluminum Volvo Prop (One of the only props available for the 270 short shaft)

Anyone got ideas on whatís going on here?
« Last Edit: September 03, 2020, 09:54:02 PM by NBD925 »

Offline Plugcheck

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Re: 1972 Glastron Bayflite V164 AQ130
« Reply #19 on: September 03, 2020, 10:16:38 PM »
Sounds like you have checked just about everything.   Compression at cranking speed is acceptable.   I would consider looking up the cam specs and running some tests to see if the lift and duration is correct.  Would also insure the timing marks are correct as well as knowing if the cam was installed  advanced or retarded.  Just a thought since it has always performed this way. 
Michael
1979 CVZ-18 388 CI Vortec Mouse
1980 CVX-16SS 140 Mercruiser
1979 CVX-16 Johnson 175
2002 Bennington 2275CC 90 Mercury
1985 Intimidator project
1989 Lowe 200 Redneck fishin Toon
2001 Godfrey Sweetwater pontoon 115 Rude